Deja Vu: Rex Grossman Is Your New Quinn Gray
by Tim on Jun 16, 2009 2:31 PM CDT
in News
31 comments
Although it was met with quite a bit of hand-wringing and "Orlovksy must look terrible" yelps, I think Rex Grossman's arrival in H-Town is going to end up a non-story. Remember when Quinn Gray signed a one-year deal with your Houston Texans in March of 2008? Many of us breathlessly wondered whether a trade of Sage Rosenfels was imminent, or whether Gray was Schaub insurance, or whether Kubes was serious about carrying three QBs on the active roster. And what happened? Gray got cut before he ever took a preseason snap.
Now, a little more than a year later, Rex Grossman signs a one-year deal with the Texans, and the cycle begins anew, complete with Kubes repeating his intent to dress three QBs. The only real difference from last year is the dramatically decreased, dare I say negligible, possibility of the incumbent No. 2 quarterback being dealt, replaced by the reality that the organization just gave pretty decent guaranteed money to Dan Orlovsky to get him in a Texans uniform. It's a bit early for buyer's remorse, isn't it? Orlovsky hasn't even put the pads on yet. Honestly, I find it hard to imagine that Smithiak or anyone else would tacitly admit they whiffed so badly on a high-dollar free agent acquisition that they'd be lining up his replacement before training camp began.
Thus, like Quinn Gray, I'm betting that Rex Grossman will be little more than a camp body. From the organization's perspective, bringing Grossman to town is a great move. He's been a starter and has playoff experience. We can say what we want about the guy, but that doesn't grow on trees. For the one-year minimum, why not bring Grossman in?
Truth be told, I'm shocked that Grossman couldn't find a better situation than Houston. Because when it all shakes out, I'd wager the 2009 Houston Texans depth chart at QB looks eerily similar to the 2008 depth chart--Matt Schaub's name at the top, followed by a quarterback with a trisyllabic surname and nothing else.
0 recs |
31 comments
|
Email
Print
Comments
Fortunatly
Quinn Gray did not play in a Super Bowl before becoming a Texan even if in Grossman’s case the defense led him there, you could say the same for Big Ben prior to this year.
by tkiller314 on Jun 16, 2009 5:54 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Oops
Except the Steelers won in Big Ben’s first.
by tkiller314 on Jun 16, 2009 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with your conclusion Tim
and still wonder why we laid out $625K. Is it an insurance policy against both Schaub and trisyllabic being concomitantly disabled? or is it a statement that Smithiak is already worried that he overpaid for tri-S and needs a palatable exit strategy? If it’s the former, then I think it is a senseless waste of capital considering the multiple contract crises. I hope to god it’s not the latter. Either way I don’t like it. I have not been impressed with Grossman, and would much rather groom a young QB3 on the practice squad. Kubiak is unlikely to carry 3 QB’s on the roster, much less dress out 3 on gameday.
Is this rule still in force? (from NFL.com)
NFL’S “third-quarterback” rule — sometimes misunderstood:
Seventeen years ago (1991) the third-quarterback rule was instituted to enable teams to have an emergency quarterback available who was not on the 45-man game-day active roster, since many teams, for strategic purposes, only carried two quarterbacks on their game-day roster.
Everybody thinks they understand the NFL’s “third-quarterback” rule. But do they?
The rule states that if a third quarterback is inserted before the fourth quarter, a team’s first two quarterbacks cannot be used in the game at any position.
Another aspect of the rule is sometimes misunderstood. It is a coach’s decision as to whether a third quarterback will be used.
The active quarterbacks do not have to be injured for a team to use its third quarterback.
Link: http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d809f6279&template=with-video&confirm=true
It took the Astros 44 years to get to the Series, the Oilers-Texans are due to get to the big dance...Go Texans!!!!!
by oiler-texan diehard on Jun 16, 2009 6:27 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Whenever you post....
I get so turned on. It must be the eau de Coors Light that does it.
by bigfatdrunk on Jun 16, 2009 9:05 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
oops
That was supposed to be an email. Luckily, I didn’t sign it.
Heh.
I think Quinn Gray is a great comp. He turned out to be nothing more than pre-season fodder for Saalam’s broken assignments. I think we’re throwing the Sex Cannon a career life-line here, though we should definitely be guarding our women-folk much more diligently. But I’ll bet anybody (limit 1) a beer that Sexy Rexy doesn’t break camp with the adults – injuries excepted.
by bigfatdrunk on Jun 16, 2009 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
injuries excepted is a cop out
cuz thats HALF of the reason he’s wearing a texans practice jersey.
The other half is trisyllabic completely busting.
Smushiak will take us to the playoffs in 2009.
by texanphil on Jun 17, 2009 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And both reasons are confirmed?
You must have a better relationship w/ Kubes or Smith than our old friend Pancakes. And even if that were the case, I still wouldn’t trust that they flat out told you the truth….NFL coaches & FO folks are not known for such things.
My point is that you cannot dismiss a guess by BFD about the reasons behind this, and then insert your own as factual evidence.
by Shake on Jun 18, 2009 8:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nuh uh, Peter King told me otherwise
"I'm just looking forward to something great happening in the city of Houston" - Tracy McGrady
Still waiting...
by DreKeem on Jun 16, 2009 9:52 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
The difference is
…that Rex Grossman is a better QB than Quinn Gray, and probably better than Dan Orlovsky, too. I think Grossman is no worse than Rosenfels, and his contract is a real value. Orlovsky is the unknown quantity, and we overpaid for him.
Kubiak didn’t exactly make it his intent to dress three QBs. I hope we do carry three QBs, though. But I also hope we don’t need them.
by buffalospeeddealer on Jun 16, 2009 11:05 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Wait, did you just say Grossman is no worse than Rosenfels?
"I'm just looking forward to something great happening in the city of Houston" - Tracy McGrady
Still waiting...
by DreKeem on Jun 16, 2009 11:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's right
…I see you can read. My question to you: what has Sage done that makes you want to put him above Grossman? I wrote “no worse.” Meaning I would rate them as about the same: good backups. Both guys are capable of having good games. They are also both capable of having games that turn into turnover-fests.
by buffalospeeddealer on Jun 17, 2009 6:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wha?
“and probably better than Dan Orlovsky”
Based on what, precisely? Certainly not stats, performance, ceiling, or those unimportant things.
by bigfatdrunk on Jun 17, 2009 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Based on
… performance? Sure. How about wins? Because Grossman wins that 19 to zero. Isn’t the internet great? I actually feel like I’m talking to a big, fat drunk.
Also, notice I said “probably” better? The truth is we don’t know who’s better. I like both of these guys … they’re Texans now.
Geez, you guys are turning me into something I never thought I’d be a year ago … a Rex Grossman apologist.
by buffalospeeddealer on Jun 17, 2009 7:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Measuring a quarterback by how many games he has won
Is like estimating the value of your car by looking at your CD collection. It’s a terrible way to evaluate quarterbacks.
While you’re on the internet, why don’t you go check out Football Outsiders. They have as objective an analysis system out there. You’ll find that Sexy Rexy was ranked 43rd out of all qbs in DYAR, just one ahead of Mr. David Carr (in 2007) and in 2006 – the year that the Bears played in the Super Bowl – Grossman was the 29th-ranked (by DYAR) qb in the league.
Orlovsky, on the other hand, ranked 26th in DYAR in 2008, his first year as a starter, despite the fact that he played on a much worse team.
So you could make an argument that Orlovsky is the better qb and you could also argue that he has more upside as well. All with information that is readily available on the innerwebs.
I’m pretty sure you’re right about bfd being big, fat and drunk though. :)
When I'm on the mic, I'm like global warming, you can't ignore me.
by tehGrindCrusher on Jun 17, 2009 8:42 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
It's True
And BFD hates Coors Light, which has him on several watchlists.
Looking forward to a day when being a Texans fan doesn't mean that April is the highlight of my season...
by Tim on Jun 17, 2009 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If hating Coors Light is wrong
I don’t wanna be right.
When I'm on the mic, I'm like global warming, you can't ignore me.
by tehGrindCrusher on Jun 17, 2009 9:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Banned List
Just got bigger. You and BFD go drink your microwbrews and sniff each other’s farts while the real Americans are sampling Rocky Mountain goodness, TGC.
Looking forward to a day when being a Texans fan doesn't mean that April is the highlight of my season...
by Tim on Jun 17, 2009 9:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your farts smell better
When you drink beers other than Coors Light.
When I'm on the mic, I'm like global warming, you can't ignore me.
by tehGrindCrusher on Jun 18, 2009 7:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except
… measuring a quarterback by how many games he has won is NOT “like estimating the value of your car by looking at your CD collection.” Your CD collection has nothing to do with your car. A quarterback has a lot to do with his team’s success. As Texans fans, we should know that better than most. We’ve had QBs single-handedly lose games for us.
But you’re right, you could use statistics to come up with an argument that Orlovsky’s the better qb. You could also argue (and would be correct in saying) that we don’t know how good he is yet. There’s no doubt that he has more upside. We’ve all seen Grossman’s ability (and lack thereof), but haven’t seen enough of Orlovsky to judge definitively yet. The question is: Is Orlovsky better than Grossman today? We’ll probably never know. The Texans have guaranteed money invested in Dan and basically no financial incentive to keep Rex.
But I definitely agree with you about the Coor’s Light.
by buffalospeeddealer on Jun 17, 2009 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would argue that
You have enough data on both qb’s to make an accurate comparison based on a year ago. Sexy Rexy has been in the league for a while now, he’s a pretty known commodity. I don’t think he’s going to get any better. FO is saying that Orlovsky, on the other hand, was better as a quarterback last year as a qb than Grossman ever was, and it was only his first year as a starter. Sure, he could regress just like Grossman did, but at this point a fair argument could be made, based on a pretty good analytical model (that of course has its flaws) that Orlovsky has much more upside.
And measuring a qb’s ability by how much he wins is simply foolish. It’s the same argument that VY supporters trot out all the time. Trent Dilfer won a Super Bowl, forcryingoutloud, something that has eluded the likes of Dan Marino, Jim Kelly and Warren Moon. Sure, a qb has a hand in winning, but I’d much rather take a more comprehensive look at how they play rather than their team’s results when they were under center. One is a good metric of a quarterback’s ability and one is a good measure of how good (and how lucky) a team is. It’s important to recognize the distinction.
When I'm on the mic, I'm like global warming, you can't ignore me.
by tehGrindCrusher on Jun 18, 2009 8:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Damn you and your fast typing TGC
I just finished typing a rather sarcastic response, which even included a “Trent Dilfer just TXT’d me” reference. And before I can click POST, your reply pops up. So now I will just add the following to this…
I have the same number of NFL wins and less NFL losses than Orlovsky. Therefore I must be a better NFL quarterback.
by Shake on Jun 18, 2009 8:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You discount the QB's importance WAY too much.
And rely on your footballoutsiders website way too much. Those are just numbers, dude. They’re not the end all, be all.
You bring up a great example: Vince Young. He singlehandedly won the Rose Bowl, you can’t deny that. If you do, you’re just arguing to argue, which I’m sure you are.
by buffalospeeddealer on Jun 22, 2009 6:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
From a Longhorn FB season ticket holder
No, he didn’t. He deserved the MVP award, but that 4th Down stop by the defense is what allowed VY’s final scamper into the Endzone to happen. USC converts, and that TD never happens.
by Shake on Jun 23, 2009 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
*sigh*
I’ll stand behind TGC’s response.
However, if you believe a QB is that responsible for the performance of his team, then this conversation has already jumped the shark.
The question is: Is Orlovsky better than Grossman today? We’ll probably never know.
Ah, but we can get a damn good idea, can’t we?
Orlovsky put up a 72.6 QB rating playing for a historically bad squad, including an incredibly sucky o-line, which ranked 31st in pass protection (according to FO).
Sex Cannon’s best (sample size considered) season was 73.9 behind Chicago’s ***9th*** ranked o-line. Over the last two years, Sexy Rexy couldn’t keep his job, thanks in large part to his approx 63 QB rating over 2007-2008.
Orlovsky is three years younger, and there’s no argument he possesses better physical tools than does Rex.
That’s OK, though. I have a stupid internet nym, so my argument fails.
by bigfatdrunk on Jun 18, 2009 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
--Yawn--
Again, more numbers. You guys should watch games every once in awhile. But first learn to read: I said “probably better”, not “better.” And I said QBs have a lot to do with their team’s success, not that they are solely responsible. But I guess it’s easier to argue by putting words in my mouth.
by buffalospeeddealer on Jun 22, 2009 7:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
3rd QB?
Didn’t the Texans just grab the Tight End/QB/DE/FB from Rice? That guy could run the wild cat and sling it as good as Rex or Dan ever could. We never need to dress 3 QBs with James Casey on the roster.
belee’ dat
by Cactus Jack Sancho on Jun 17, 2009 12:14 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
exactly!
I can see it now…Casey drops back and lets it fly, Casey then lays a viscous block down for hiimself and Casey pulls a Van Pelt to snag the recpetion from his own pass for the first down! Then grabbing the mic and heading into the stands, Casey recaps the play while ushering some fans to their seats, and making his way over to the Pep band for his solo…..The “Renaisance Man” legend is slowly growing as we begin plugging this kid in every position on the team. This has potential doesn’t it…what can’t this guy do?
by Smittybaby on Jun 17, 2009 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I still feel that
If we could have got Grossman at this bargain bin price that we shouldn’t have overpayed Orlovsky. You are probably right, I think Grossman will hang around longer than Gray, but unless Schaub goes down early or Orlovsky disappoints, Grossman will have a tough time cracking the top two…and in all likelyhood will be gone before too long.
However, say what you will about Dan, but he has yet to win a single football game and Grossman has helped a team to a superbowl. TT mentioned how bad he has to be to lose as often as he did with the Bears D, and while that is true to an extent, the QB lines up with the offense not the defense. I’m positive he would look alot better lined up with Johnson and Slaton.
Currently Listening to: Leroy - Good Time
"I feel like I'm the best, but you're not going to get me to say that." - Hall of Fame WR Jerry Rice
by last texans fan on Jun 17, 2009 6:55 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
This horse... Is dead.
Wow, you guys are really whacking away at this old nag, aren’t you?
Fact. We did not overpay for a young backup QB with starting experience. Fact.
Fact. $625K is chicken feed, as contracts go. Fact.
This deal was prolly done over brunch. Did any of you guys hear any big talk, leading up to it, like Rick was spending valuable time and resources on it? No, I don’t think you did.
Fact. That time/money spent on Rex won’t affect negotiations with any other player ever. Fact.
Bacon tastes good... Pork chops taste good.
by beefy on Jun 17, 2009 10:44 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Its the offseason
Not much to talk about at this time of year, might as well make a big news story – like the Texans signing a superbowl veteran QB as their backup- count for what it can. Even if it is Rex Grossman. But yeah its about time to move on.
And thats a fact Jack. Ooooooh! pulls out his chainsaw (you Houstonians know what im talkin about)
Currently Listening to: Leroy - Good Time
"I feel like I'm the best, but you're not going to get me to say that." - Hall of Fame WR Jerry Rice
by last texans fan on Jun 17, 2009 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
Related FanPosts on Battle Red Blog
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2009 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
