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Time For The Cowher Power Hour!

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It seems that the popular thing for casual fans (i.e., not us miserable bloggers) of the Texans is to have blindingly loyal support for the team to hire Bill Cowher to be the new coach should Gary Kubiak finally get his pink slip at season's end.

On the other side (again, us despairing and despondent bloggers) of the fence, the popular thing seems to be an "anybody but Cowher" approach. Both have compelling reasons for and against "The Chin" as the possible next leader of the Texans.

So, with that in mind, I figured I'd take this opportunity to further the debate that was started in this thread by BoneCollector27 to expand on the debate and tackle many of the reasons people are against his hire. Hit the jump and hold your breath.

Star-divide

Before I begin and Rip Jersey proclaims me to be in "Camp Cowher," let me state that I am not necessarily all in for Cowher. I'm certainly not against him here, because I would like to see it. But I'm not ready to throw all my chips into that pile exclusively. The point of this article is to bring up many of the points that people have against him and try to debunk if they're true or if those guys are just repeating what they've heard from others. Let us begin.

"Cowher was only successful in Pittsburgh because of Dick LeBeau."

This is probably the number one reason I've read/heard from the blogging community about a reason not to hire Cowher. It may be true, it may not. In many ways, it makes sense. Pittsburgh had a reputation for being an incredibly tough defensive team while Cowher was teamed with LeBeau. And now that Mike Tomlin has taken over, still paired with LeBeau, they're still known as a great defensive team. So there we have a pretty big argument that this is proper logic.

However, there are many like myself that feel like this is a complete cop-out argument that they heard someone else say and believe that it just must be the truth. See, the same argument can be made that LeBeau had no real positive track record anywhere else he coached. LoneSpot pointed it out pretty well in the aforementioned thread:

Re: Dick LeBeau

Pittsburgh Steelers (1992–1996), (2004–present)
Cincinnati Bengals (1997–2002)

From ‘97-2002, the Steelers had two losing seasons but also went to two AFC Championship Games (’97 to Denver, and ’01 to New England). All without LeBeau.

Meanwhile in Cinci, the Bengals D never ranked higher than 17th and endured some horrible seasons with LeBeau as DC (‘97-’99) and HC (‘00-’02).

That begs the question, why is LeBeau so highly coveted without ever having success outside of Pittsburgh?

Pretty good points, if you ask me.

I hear all the time that Cowher was only successful because of the people that he was surrounded with.  To me, assuming that he wouldn't be able to surround himself with good people here is just that--an assumption. Even Aaron, an anti-Cowher guy, brought up a good point in the last Luv Ya Steel Blue podcast. He said the mark of a true leader on the football field is a guy who recognizes his weaknesses and surrounds himself with people who excel in those places. We don't know that Cowher wouldn't do that here. We do know that he likely wouldn't just hire his buddies for key spots like the current head coach has done here.

"Cowher is going to want complete control, including personnel moves."

This has been the rumor for a long time, but do we have any hard evidence that this is the truth? We don't even know for sure that he will be heading back into coaching this year yet. This is all based off of a report by Mort at ESPN quoting a "source close to Bill Cowher." It could be complete bunk, just like the one last year. So to assume that he is going to try demand complete control over everything up to and including personnel moves, again, is an assumption.

"Bringing in Cowher would require switching to a 3-4 and I don't want us to rebuild."

To me, fear of switching to a 3-4 shouldn't be anyone's primary reason against hiring Cowher. Seriously, it isn't like there is a quick fix to the defense Houston currently has installed. No matter how "close" Bob thinks they are, it's true. A new regime would turnover, at a minimum, a quarter of these guys. Switching to a 3-4 would be fine by me because we would finally go out and get a fat ass nose tackle to push the line instead of using the "light, quick guys" to shoot the gaps. This is something that would go over pretty well with most of the BRB staff, I believe.

The main reason to be against this move would be that Mario Williams isn't considered a 3-4 guy. That is a real concern that I don't have a defense for. I'm still not sold that he couldn't become a DeMarcus Ware type in a 3-4, but I'm not the "Xs and Os" type a lot of the other guys here are and perhaps they could touch more on this one in the comments below.

As far as using the word "rebuilding," I think it's a bit of a stretch. This isn't a 2 win team like when Gary took them over. Rebuilding isn't required. On the other hand, the team hasn't won jack shit yet. How can they "rebuild" if they've never won anything? Every year there are teams that look like they're going to rebuild and yet they have an incredible turnaround (Kansas City and Tampa Bay come to mind this year) and make the playoffs. People need to stop thinking it takes 4 or 5 seasons to make a competitive or playoff bound football team. That's not how other franchises in the NFL work.

"Cowher would choose Miami or New York over Houston."

While we were mentioned with the Giants and Dolphins as his preferred destinations, the rumor is that we are third on that list. All three of those teams still have coaches. Even after the meltdown that New York had against the Eagles the other day, the co-owner of the team denied the Cowher rumors and gave full support to Tom Coughlin. Bottom line is that one more win and they're in the playoffs. They just won a Super Bowl three years ago, and there is no real reason to believe Coughlin would be canned unless the owner just had a huge hard-on for Cowher. Coughlin would be unemployed for all of five minutes.

Tony Sparano's job in Miami may be more in question. He did take them to the playoffs his first year in Miami, but they've underachieved in the past two years. However, he has the excuse of not having a legitimate NFL quarterback this year to blame for the .500 record. Also, the team is said to be suffering monetarily. This would conflict with giving Cowher the money that he is said to be looking for. I believe Sparano has at least one more year under the headset in Miami.

Then you got Houston. No one can get a real grasp on what Bob is thinking. He comes out in support of Gary Kubiak AGAIN and then Gary absolutely embarrasses the owner with the team's performance a few days later in Tennessee. Not a peep from Bob since, and I have no reason to believe we'll hear from him again until a day or two after the season is over, likely when Frank Bush is fired. Will that also be the decision has been made to let Gary Kubiak go? Maybe, but not likely. Still, a lot can happen in two weeks, especially with this club.

One thing that I find interesting though is that last season Cowher was said to have listed a couple teams he wanted to coach if possible. If I recall correctly, it was the Bears and the Texans. So at least in that, Houston has been consistent. I know he's a tool, but Peter King had an interesting quote in his Monday Morning Quarterback column this week.

My guess is unless there's an opening in Houston, Cowher's going to stay in TV for one more year, at least.

Houston is an attractive job, regardless of how messed up the team is in our opinions. There are great facilities and (arguably) good ownership. They have an explosive offense and a franchise trio in QB Matt Schaub, RB Arian Foster and WR Andre Johnson. They have multiple pieces on defense that could play on a winning team and their fan support is surprisingly loyal. I say "surprisingly" because if the Rockets or Astros were this bad to mediocre for this amount of time, those stadiums would be empty and selling out season tickets would be a joke. It's an attractive destination that I think more coaches than just Bill Cowher will be attracted to should it open.

Cowher20111_medium

In conclusion, if you want to put me in "Camp Cowher," go ahead. I'd love to have him here, I won't lie. But I don't believe that he is going to be the one-year miracle worker everyone believes he would be. I also believe that any fanbase of a team that has had nine seasons of shame and mediocrity shouldn't be quite so picky to turn down a Super Bowl winning coach.

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HERE HER!

I heard Brian Cushing like to do it with girls in a really uncomfortable place and i am not talking about the back seat of a Volkswagen
Go Texans!

by Taco Joe on Dec 22, 2010 2:05 PM CST up reply actions  

I believe we have the makings of a pretty good front 7

and if we switch to the 3-4 we might as well throw out any hope of not being one of the worst defenses in the league again next year.

"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."

by nolander on Dec 22, 2010 10:52 AM CST reply actions   2 recs

Thank you for your opinion

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 22, 2010 10:55 AM CST up reply actions  

we all think we have a good front seven except me.

i mean if we go to a 3-4 D i would be ok i mean shaun cody is not really that great. i would not mind having another linebacker in there shit bring pollard down to outside linebacker

by southpaw70 on Dec 22, 2010 2:23 PM CST up reply actions  

i think thats a crock of BS.

A. It doesnt get worse.
B. our Defense has problems beyond just performance. our players regress. thats on coaching
C. most importantly, our defense does not come ready to play and that too is on coaching.
also anyone who thinks that brian cushing and DeJesus wont work in a 3-4 are crazy. Cushing would fit excellent and while DeMeco is not the exact model of a 3-4 MLB, he’s a hell of alot better than most 3-4’s have. our front 4 would be fucked but you know what, antonio smith wouldnt be half bad at DE and Mario would likely be trade bait (which makes me a sad panda) or a DE/OLB until we get the players we need.

My body has built a tolerance to bleach. My favorite flavor is Lemon.

by BattleRedHusker on Dec 23, 2010 7:25 AM CST up reply actions  

Don't forget about Barwin...

He’d make an excellent 3-4 olb

by TexansPride on Dec 23, 2010 10:43 AM CST via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

You are basing that solely on his size

He has never even played the position.

Choo Choo! Get on board the Marvin Lewis train for 2011 Defensive Coordinator.

by DaGoaT on Dec 23, 2010 11:47 AM CST up reply actions  

But that doesn't matter.

Kubiak sucks so we should start from scratch and use players that are used to a 4-3 scheme and forced them to fit a 3-4 scheme! We’ve done it before with Capers and the results were fucking awesome right?

"Eff you mothereffer!"

-Bernard Pollard-

by Jordann on Dec 23, 2010 11:53 AM CST up reply actions  

Does it matter?

When we drafted Barwin he’d only been playing DE for a year, hadn’t he? I think he’d be capable of adjusting if he had to.

I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now help me find my pants!

A word of advice for Texans fans. Remember John Milton's Paradise Lost: The mind is its own place. It can make a Hell of Heaven and a Heaven of Hell. Kinda sums up the last nine years, doesn't it?

by UprootedTexan on Dec 23, 2010 11:58 AM CST up reply actions   1 recs

I for one think the Texans defense needs to go in a different direction

Maybe it is just scheme. Maybe it is a complete change from a 4-3 to a 3-4. The transition from 4-3 to 3-4? I am not so convinced as some that it is such a big transition that it can’t be done in one season. I think the Texans personnel may be very capable of making the transition. But, I do know this, though, if you have some egoist like Albert Haynesworth on your team, it will be more difficult. I don’t think that guy is on the Texans right now. I would think they are willing and able to make the transition. If there was a defense in the league right now that could do it, I think the Texans could. But, if Kubiak stays, I don’t see that as happening, so this may just be discussion fodder on a blog, is all it is. We will likely never be able to see this kind of transition go into practice.

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

by Rip Jersey on Dec 23, 2010 12:08 PM CST up reply actions  

I'm just pretty pissed that even adopting your "best case" estimate...

…of being able to do the transition “in one season”… THAT means that we get to already WRITE OFF next year TOO as a total defensive “re-architecting” effort.

I guess it doesn’t really matter… as long as whatever scheme we are rebuilding to happens to be one that the new DC really understands and can coach…

This so sucks to still have two games left in THIS regular season and be wondering if there’s hope to salvage NEXT season.

/Clorox-gulp

"velocitas eradico"

by DilloTex on Dec 23, 2010 6:05 PM CST up reply actions  

How many young players have actually played the position?

There are what… half a dozen college programs that run it from time to time?

I’m getting a bit disillusioned with the 4-3, myself. A quick glance at defensive statistics really tells it all. Last year, 7/10 of the top scoring and yardage defenses ran the 3-4. This year, it’s 8/10 in scoring. Then looking outside the top 20, 8/12 of the worst defenses in the league run a 4-3…

The Texans are going to improve next year regardless of which scheme they run. But just looking around the league… I like the idea of having an extra linebacker on the field. Talk about nose tackles all you want, but the 4-3 means you need two DTs, and we’ve proven incapable of finding even one mildly competent DT in nine years of drafting and free agency. On the flip-side, we do an OK job with linebackers. Wouldn’t it be better to take a DT off the field?

by Nashmeister on Dec 23, 2010 3:42 PM CST up reply actions  

Seth Payne

disagrees with your thoughts about the texans not finding competent DT’s.

"Eff you mothereffer!"

-Bernard Pollard-

by Jordann on Dec 23, 2010 3:59 PM CST up reply actions  

While disagreeing

He also broke his leg and will be out 8 weeks. Jerry Deloach time!

by riversmccown on Dec 23, 2010 9:56 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

I Laughed

Rec’d.

Looking forward to a day when being a Texans fan doesn't mean that April is the highlight of my season...

by Tim on Dec 24, 2010 9:53 PM CST up reply actions  

We have to have a need first. Isn't that the first step? Creating an opening?

Kubiak would need to go. I believe based on what I heard from the Kubiak Show on 610 this week, that Kubiak is a beaten man. I think he has seen the handwriting on the wall and he is on his way out. I am holding my breath on this.

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 22, 2010 11:15 AM CST reply actions  

The Gary Kubiak Show

Gary takes responsibility for everything

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 22, 2010 11:45 AM CST up reply actions  

I hope we don't create an opening

without knowing for certain that Cowher or another possible improvement will definitely take the job. In my mind, if you don’t have a sure thing to replace with a proven winner (Cowher/Fox/Fisher/Gruden, but not so much Gruden) then don’t make a change at HC. But Jobu as my witness, if most, if not all, of the defensive staff and defensive talent evaluation folks are not gone or completely overhauled, I will destroy Reliant Park. With mind bullets.

Blind fandom is all I got left.

by LoneSpot on Dec 22, 2010 2:24 PM CST up reply actions  

lol

Save the bullets. I don’t think Bob would axe Kubiak without having a better option. We’re not talking about Josh McDaniels here. At least Gary is somewhat competent.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 2:31 PM CST up reply actions  

That sounds like Buffalo the last time they were shopping for a new HC

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 22, 2010 2:39 PM CST up reply actions  

Unpossible

There’s only 1 Reliant Park.

Blind fandom is all I got left.

by LoneSpot on Dec 22, 2010 2:52 PM CST up reply actions  

Nine seasons of shame and misery?

Seriously? I’m not going to argue this with you because you obviously are allowed your opinion/agenda. You do remember they changed the expansion draft rules and free agency because of the successes of J’Ville and Carolina – and they didn’t make it easier. That said, do you honestly believe we should have been in the playoffs by year 4?

Not trying to start a fight, it’s a legitimate question.

"Eat Well, Stay Fit, Die Anyway" - Ancient Chinese Proverb

by Hugh Jarce on Dec 22, 2010 11:26 AM CST reply actions  

That was a long time ago, Hugh Jarce

Why are we thinking about year four when we are currently in year nine?

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 22, 2010 11:31 AM CST up reply actions  

Because his statement,,,,

“Nine seasons of shame and misery” implies that he expected something much sooner. You know, statements like that just don’t have the same hitting power as something like, “Four seasons of mediocrity”, eh?

"Eat Well, Stay Fit, Die Anyway" - Ancient Chinese Proverb

by Hugh Jarce on Dec 22, 2010 11:55 AM CST up reply actions  

Oh FFS

Did you really think we’d be a perennial playoff powerhouse by season 5?

"Eat Well, Stay Fit, Die Anyway" - Ancient Chinese Proverb

by Hugh Jarce on Dec 22, 2010 12:01 PM CST up reply actions  

I believed we'd at least be IN the playoffs

That’s not an unreasonable expectation really.

Let me ask you this……if we were to actually make the playoffs under Gary Kubiak, do you think we would suddenly be a “perennial powerhouse”? Or do you get the gut feeling that we’d be one and done?

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 12:09 PM CST up reply actions  

I predicted us to be 8-8 this season...

…which in hindsight looks wildly optimistic. I think it’s fair to say I have no idea about playoffs as evidenced by my overexhuberant season prediction, I will say this though. I think Kubiak has shown an ability to fix things. For instance, the biggest moans last off-season were:

1. You’ll never be a playoff team without a running game!!!!!
2. You’ll never be a playoff team without better redzone performance!!!!!
3. You’ll never be a playoff team without a reliable kicker!!!!!

Obviously I’ve taken liberty with the exclamation marks, but you get the idea. I’ll also say this, who on here predicted before the pre-season that our D would go from reasonably bad last season to historically bad this season?

"Eat Well, Stay Fit, Die Anyway" - Ancient Chinese Proverb

by Hugh Jarce on Dec 22, 2010 12:18 PM CST up reply actions  

well

I predicted 9-7 again but the question in Hugh Jarce’s post that I was replying to was did we expect to be a perennial playoff contender

by season 5?

And the answer for me is that I expected to make the playoffs within 5.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 12:35 PM CST up reply actions  

And the answer for me is that I expected to make the playoffs within 5.

I still hate Casserly and Capers.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 12:37 PM CST up reply actions   2 recs

Kubiak fixing things

I agree he’s done a great job of fixing things that were weak areas in the previous seasons, but then we always seem to go backwards in others. Frank Bush was supposed to be the fix for Richard Smith, and it was for most of last season, but then we regressed this season. Yes, that blame can be pinned on Bush but it was Gary who hired him.

I’m not saying there aren’t really good positives about Kubiak, but I just think Cowher easily trumps most of those, except maybe the offensive prowess. That’s a big one in Gary’s favor.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 12:32 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

agree

I think we share the same feelings towards Kubiak and Cowher

and the clouds opened up and God said "I Hate you Texans Fans."

by Joe25 on Dec 22, 2010 2:07 PM CST up reply actions  

I fail to see see how getting more conservative on offense would automatically hurt this particular team. Our talented offense has failed to take pressure off of our thin E-fense for at least the past season and a half…

by Cut Block on Dec 24, 2010 3:39 AM CST up reply actions  

So you've been ashamed and or embarrassed of this franchise for nine years?

Which begs the question: Should we have made the playoffs our first year?

"Eat Well, Stay Fit, Die Anyway" - Ancient Chinese Proverb

by Hugh Jarce on Dec 22, 2010 11:56 AM CST up reply actions  

Houston could've gotten there that early

had Casserly and Capers known what they were doing. Looking back at the early drafts…it’s pretty miserable. The team just struck out left and right and couldn’t build any sort of foundation.

Nothing to do with 2011….but that addresses that question.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 11:35 AM CST up reply actions  

fun factoid.

No other franchise in the history of the nfl has taken this long to get into the playoffs.

by AlDe2356 on Dec 23, 2010 2:46 AM CST up reply actions  

There are more teams now than ever before. So I believe it is harder to get into the playoffs these days.

A Texas Wannabe, born and raised in New Zealand. Currently located 7343miles South west of Houston.

by distant_texans_fan on Dec 23, 2010 3:29 AM CST up reply actions  

That's not correct

I looked up those a while ago. Some teams took much longer to get into the playoffs.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 23, 2010 10:57 AM CST up reply actions  

Yeah, here we go....found it

Arizona: 9 years (The franchise started in 1920 but did not play a playoff game until 1947. It also took them 10 years to get to the playoffs after their move to Arizona in 1988).
Atlanta: 12 years
Chicago: 11 years (Their franchise also started in 1920 but did not play a playoff game until 1933).
Denver: 17 years
Green Bay: Professional team started in 1921 but no playoff game until 1936.
New England: 10 years (They did get an AFL playoff birth three years after their birth, but that was not a NFL playoff spot).
New Orleans: 20 years
New York Giants: 15 years (They had pre-Super Bowl NFL Championships and playoff births….but post Super Bowl era? Nothing from 66-80)
Philadelphia: 12 years (Pre-SB era they went 14 years before their 1st playoff birth)
Pittsburgh: Pre-SB era they went 14 years without a playoff birth.
San Diego: 13 years (Like NE, they did make it in the AFL days though)

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 23, 2010 2:10 PM CST up reply actions  

Wow.

Just look at that. It does take a while for a new team to make the playoffs.

Who woulda thunk it?

The thing is, people nowadays are more results oriented than ever. They want to WIN WIN WIN NOW without having to wait too long for it. Yeah it’s been nine years, but I can wait longer as long as it’s done right.

Is Smithiak on the right path? Not entirely. Can they get on the right track eventually? I think so.

"Eff you mothereffer!"

-Bernard Pollard-

by Jordann on Dec 23, 2010 3:34 PM CST up reply actions  

I agree 100%

But that’s just me.

"Eff you mothereffer!"

-Bernard Pollard-

by Jordann on Dec 23, 2010 10:05 PM CST up reply actions  

"Cowher is going to want complete control including personnel moves"

I saw that quote and immediately questioned it. “Complete control” can only be interpreted one way. I just don’t see Cowher asking for complete control. I could be wrong. Just don’t see it.

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 22, 2010 11:35 AM CST reply actions  

That's almost the same argument as......

“He’s going to want too much money.”

Pure speculation. The truth is we have no idea because Cowher hasn’t made any public statements on the subject, and I wouldn’t expect him to considering his current position with the media. Personally I think he’d take the usual amount of control as long as he gets to pick his coaches and has a say in personnel……pretty typical situation for most.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 12:01 PM CST up reply actions  

This was my main point in the other thread
But I also believe that any fanbase of a team that has had nine seasons of shame and mediocrity shouldn’t be quite so picky to turn down a Super Bowl winning coach.

We’re in no position to turn down a Super Bowl winner if Bob decides that’s who he wants. For the record, I’m not saying Cowher is the perfect answer because I know with him comes the possibility of total rebuild, but out of the candidates that are currently available he’s at the top of the list.

All this talk about him being overrated is nonsense imo. You simply don’t have the type of success in the NFL if your HC isn’t up to the task. That being said, you also can’t do it alone, so it takes a whole staff of good coaches to get it done…..which is something we don’t have in Houston. My argument is that Cowher will bring in those people because he has a great list of connections willing to work with him, whereas Kubiak’s list is pretty short (although one can argue it’s getting better). And I believe his staff would get more out of our current roster than we’re seeing now, because they would demand more.

Cowher would also fire and enthusiasm. Something I just don’t see out of Gary, as much as I would like to. Like Rip said in the other thread, Gary’s a very nice guy and everyone likes and respects him. But I for one would trade a nice guy for someone that gets me fired up. I’m sick and tired of being a finesse team, aren’t you?

As much as I like Gary Kubiak and wish to see him succeed, I’d be a liar if I said I wouldn’t jump at the chance to replace him with a proven winner at this point.

.02

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 11:54 AM CST reply actions  

Are we really a finesse team now?

We stop the run and have the best power rushing game going up the middle. We probably have more size than speed on defense, too.

by Nashmeister on Dec 22, 2010 12:12 PM CST up reply actions  

yes, we are definitely a finesse team

Power rushing? No. Zone blocking is not power rushing. And we are considerably small on the defensive side.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 12:17 PM CST up reply actions  

Labeled as finesse

but we’ve seen a lot of success in running up the middle and in short yardage situations.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 12:20 PM CST up reply actions  

Zone-blocking is a technique.

It doesn’t mean that they’re not physical. The goal of power running is to churn out tough yards, no? And when it comes to short-yardage and goal-line running, the Texans are tops in the league running it up the gut.

As for defense… The only positions we’re small at are one DT spot, and possibly FS. Our DEs are bigger than average, our LBs are average, and our CBs are probably bigger than average. They’re not good, but it’s not because they try to be a finesse team.

by Nashmeister on Dec 22, 2010 1:08 PM CST up reply actions  

Nobody tries to be a finesse team

It just happens. You can’t look at the Houston Texans as a whole and honestly tell me you see a hard nosed team. I wish we were, but when I watch our games I don’t usually find myself saying “we’re going to beat the shit out of this team.” Sometimes we toughen up for random games, but on a consistent basis we’re not what I would consider a tough team.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 2:24 PM CST up reply actions  

We have a finesse defense

Which is NEVER a compliment.

Blind fandom is all I got left.

by LoneSpot on Dec 22, 2010 2:32 PM CST up reply actions  

The rah-rah, firing people up thing is overrated

These guys get paid 6, 7, 8 figures to play a game that they love. If they need someone firing them up then there’s something wrong with those players, and they probably should question their career choice.

Finesse works just as often as physical – that’s why Ray Lewis and Peyton Manning each have 1 ring. It’s why for every 85 Bears you get a 00 Rams. It’s a matter of playing well…good teams can win games in a number of different ways.

As for Cowher’s network and past success…people are forgetting that he stepped into a seamless machine in Pittsburgh. Chuck Noll retired after decades and Cowher came in to a stable organization that had a lot in place. That’s not to discredit Cowher finding good defensive assistant coaches (his offensive track record leaves a bit to be desired), but the situation in Houston would be anything but stable. It’s why I have said he’s not a miracle worker…because, unlike say….a Marvin Lewis who had to build in Cincinnati’s culture of crap….he’s never really had to build something, and there is some building that needs to be done in Houston.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 12:12 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

Maybe what he was trying to say was,

you never played sports for 6, 7, or 8 figures….

I think you’re off on the statement that Cowher stepped into a seamless machine. I recommend that you do some research and find out more about Cowher. You have repeatedly gone on this board stating his accomplishments as a HC were all handed to him. There was nothing handed to him. You need to do some research and educate yourself. If I follow your thinking, Chuck Knoll should be thrown out of the HOF.

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

by Rip Jersey on Dec 23, 2010 11:49 AM CST up reply actions  

You keep assuming things about what I'm saying, Rip

and you’re not making any points at all.

The Steelers weren’t in rebuild mode when Cowher took over.

Noll was coach from 69-91 and retired after a 7-9 season where Pittsburgh lost 3 or 4 games by less than 7. It wasn’t a bad job. The front office had little turnover when Cowher came on board while the team had a bunch of starters in place, and that’s what I meant by seamless machine. It wasn’t an expansion franchise or poorly run franchise where a lot had to be changed or built. Cowher simply had to bring in his own staff and make some tweaks.

And what Cowher stepped into has nothing to do with Noll’s career or what he built up there…but keep assuming things.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 23, 2010 2:19 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

There was already a system in place

when Cowher took over. But that doesn’t matter, COWHER MADE THIS TEAM SO MUCH BETTER BY HIMSELF. IT WAS ALL COWHER. ALL COWHER.

"Eff you mothereffer!"

-Bernard Pollard-

by Jordann on Dec 23, 2010 3:36 PM CST up reply actions  

You misspeak the facts

You really need to do some research on Cowher. I can’t waste my time trying to continually correct you. Just do the research yourself.

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

by Rip Jersey on Dec 27, 2010 4:16 PM CST up reply actions  

wait

Tecmo SuperBowl and NBA Jamz don’t count!

Choo Choo! Get on board the Marvin Lewis train for 2011 Defensive Coordinator.

by DaGoaT on Dec 23, 2010 11:50 AM CST up reply actions  

reply fail

meant for TexansDC

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 12:24 PM CST up reply actions  

We haven't

It’s just a matter as to where you want to put blame for that. I put it on the defense…since Houston has never had a good defense in its history. Last season’s “BEST DEFENSE EVAR” was the best and bfd’s shown how much of a sheep in wolf’s clothing that was.

I look at an offense that has improved over the past 3 seasons and say…why not take a crack at it with a real defensive coordinator before we have to hit the reset button? That’s just my line of thinking.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 12:36 PM CST up reply actions   2 recs

The offense is loads better this year

if not just because we have gone from being horrible in the red zone to being one of the best teams in the league there. On Offense.

"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."

by nolander on Dec 22, 2010 12:43 PM CST up reply actions  

And we threw a fade!

It was only once, and it wasn’t successful. But, still!!!

"Eff you mothereffer!"

-Bernard Pollard-

by Jordann on Dec 22, 2010 1:49 PM CST up reply actions  

There was that one td

to andre from like the 20, that kind of looked like a fade!

"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."

by nolander on Dec 22, 2010 1:51 PM CST up reply actions  

I do to

I wouldn’t have a problem keeping Kubiak and bringing in a legit DC. As a matter of fact that’s my preferable option for the short term, but since the discussion is about replacing him with Cowher that’s what I’m trying to stick to. When I compare the two, and consider the long term future of the team, it’s a no brainer to me.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 12:44 PM CST up reply actions  

Agree 100%

Kubiak makes mistakes, but all coaches do. By upgrading Kubiak’s surrounding cast to a competent set of defensive coaches, who can also help on the other side of the ball (preparation, for example), I think that’s a tremendous impact by itself.

A Texans fan. Really. No, I'm not kidding.
http://www.battleredblog.com
"Blind fandom is all I got left." - LoneSpot

by bigfatdrunk on Dec 22, 2010 12:44 PM CST up reply actions  

I think this is our best bet

Keep kubiak, hire a new DC and secondary coach, and ALSO a new GM. Rick smith has got to go. I think this will help alot, but don’t see how it changes our first half suckage in games….

by AllenOU on Dec 22, 2010 12:55 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

The Fence

I’m on it.

Choo Choo! Get on board the Marvin Lewis train for 2011 Defensive Coordinator.

by DaGoaT on Dec 22, 2010 1:01 PM CST reply actions  

Wait! We're all missing something here...

Mike has done a switcheroo on the original thread and replaced with this thread which is conveniently attached to his article! Anyone who knows the slightest bit about SEO will see this ruse for what it really is… 0_o

FREE Bonecollector27!

"Eat Well, Stay Fit, Die Anyway" - Ancient Chinese Proverb

by Hugh Jarce on Dec 22, 2010 1:10 PM CST reply actions   2 recs

Also

You do know that I “Work” here for free, yes? So article hits/traffic mean approximately dick in the end.

by Mike Kerns on Dec 22, 2010 1:16 PM CST up reply actions  

B-b-b-b-b-b-but

Brad says they are teh most important thing in the entire world!!!!!!!!!!!

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 1:19 PM CST up reply actions  

For the site, sure

But for my article over someone elses here, absolutely not.

Oh, and Buck Frad!

by Mike Kerns on Dec 22, 2010 1:19 PM CST up reply actions  

I've come to the conclusion that we're cursed.

It’s time to change things up: for 2011, every single Texans’ player needs to grow a mustache. Let’s make this team more like a baseball clubhouse. That’s a good start, Shaun Cody.

Now, Schaub seems a bit short on hair… I’m guessing he can’t grow one. Yet another short-coming. I’d cut him in favor of my favorite player (and the greatest QB to ever play under Kubiak):

If he won’t come out of retirement, maybe Jeff Hostetler will.

by Nashmeister on Dec 22, 2010 1:20 PM CST reply actions  

Charlie Finley is posting from his grave!

A Texans fan. Really. No, I'm not kidding.
http://www.battleredblog.com
"Blind fandom is all I got left." - LoneSpot

by bigfatdrunk on Dec 22, 2010 1:23 PM CST up reply actions  

LOL we should go for the

“child molester” stache style that the baseball Cardinals had going on two years ago. Just for intimidation purposes.

"You don't have bad luck. Bad things happen to you because you are a dumbass" - That 70's Show. Fire Frank Bush!

by RocketsAstros on Dec 22, 2010 2:36 PM CST up reply actions  

Hey Kerns,

That LoneSpot fella you reference sounds like a smart SOB. Which we all know is code for douchebag.

Blind fandom is all I got left.

by LoneSpot on Dec 22, 2010 3:55 PM CST reply actions  

...which is code for "Ladies Man"

a smart SOB once told me that

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 22, 2010 5:06 PM CST up reply actions  

He might be a douchebag, but...

Like Cowher, he knows how to surround himself with great people. Like the guy who makes the homemade brew I couldn’t stop drankin’ at the last tailgate.

by Mike Kerns on Dec 22, 2010 7:46 PM CST up reply actions  

TexansDC will be right back with his rebuttal

have patience

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 22, 2010 5:08 PM CST up reply actions  

Very well written

Could certainly stand on its own as a FP, but there’s one argument left to be addressed…

The impact on the offense and/or does this mean rebuilding is here (again)

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 6:08 PM CST up reply actions  

Yeah, once I saw it posted I thought it was a little long.

The offensive side of the ball does concern me with Cowher, since I heard he has some issues hiring a good OC. If he runs an offense like the Steelers have we might have what he needs already: a solid running game.

He won’t get rid of Schaub, because he’s better than most of the QBs available. We have Foster and (we presume) Ben Tate as our lightning and thunder of the future. The Steelers offense, if I recall correctly, is a run-first scheme. So I would expect it to resemble what we have now with Dennison, a more run-emphasized offense with a crushing defense to back it up.

Personally, I don’t think he’ll have to do a whole lot with the offense.

I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now help me find my pants!

A word of advice for Texans fans. Remember John Milton's Paradise Lost: The mind is its own place. It can make a Hell of Heaven and a Heaven of Hell. Kinda sums up the last nine years, doesn't it?

by UprootedTexan on Dec 22, 2010 6:14 PM CST up reply actions  

Keep Dennison around perhaps?

Is he capable of running the offense without daddy Kubiak watching over his shoulder?

"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."

by nolander on Dec 22, 2010 6:19 PM CST up reply actions  

I imagine he could

Although whether he will once his friend (and, more importantly, his connection) is gone is another matter. I’d like to see it happen, but I don’t see it happening.

I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now help me find my pants!

A word of advice for Texans fans. Remember John Milton's Paradise Lost: The mind is its own place. It can make a Hell of Heaven and a Heaven of Hell. Kinda sums up the last nine years, doesn't it?

by UprootedTexan on Dec 22, 2010 6:20 PM CST up reply actions  

Excellent post man

I agree about the offensive concerns. The only way we’d keep the zone block scheme is if he could convince Dennison to stay on. The only way that happens is if Kubiak somehow wouldn’t get the Denver gig.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 8:35 PM CST up reply actions  

He did so in Denver

As UT says, the question is would he stay in Houston with Kubiak gone (presumably) to Denver? I’d imagine Kubiak being fired would mean he’d take the offensive staff back to Denver.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 6:41 PM CST up reply actions  

Great stuff, UT

You filled in pretty much everything I didn’t…and then some. Have some Rec, sir.

by Mike Kerns on Dec 22, 2010 7:52 PM CST up reply actions  

This is an excellent point
Suppose we hire Cowher, I think if it happens, he draws defensive players (that fit his scheme) like Rex Ryan drew key defensive pieces to the Jets.

Great coaches attract great players. Who wouldn’t want to play for him? Seriously.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 8:37 PM CST up reply actions  

I did borrow some of my arguments from this post, actually.

I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now help me find my pants!

A word of advice for Texans fans. Remember John Milton's Paradise Lost: The mind is its own place. It can make a Hell of Heaven and a Heaven of Hell. Kinda sums up the last nine years, doesn't it?

by UprootedTexan on Dec 23, 2010 3:15 PM CST up reply actions  

Re: the Dick LeBeau thing

If the argument is that Cowher is successful because he is capable of finding and hiring good coordinators, that’s no argument at all. Kubiak hired Frank Bush, after all. Getting the right staff in place is key to success, and if Cowher has a track record of doing that better than Kubiak, how is that a knock on him? Just my two cents.

by JBal on Dec 22, 2010 5:09 PM CST reply actions  

Us pro-Cowher guys are trying figure that same thing out

The anti-Cowher guys really seem like they have their heads in the sand on this issue of Cowher or no Cowher. It’s like they want to deny that he ever was a head coach at all, but obviously they can’t. They keep trying to give the credit he has earned to everyone else that was around him and they say the record was accomplished in spite of Bill Cowher. It’s an infallible argument, I suppose. We weren’t there behind the scenes. How can we prove that the antis are wrong? They said it, so it must be right, right? I’m sure Bob McNair agrees, too, therefore Kubiak will retain his job, because can’t we use the same argument in his favor? Can’t we say the the dismal Texans’ record is due to everyone around Gary Kubiak and therefore they are to blame and not Kubiak? They are losing to spite Kubiak!

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 22, 2010 5:19 PM CST up reply actions  

Some people are pro-cowher.

Some are unsettled. Some just wants Kubiak outta here. Some wants to pair Kubiak up with a proven DC. But Rip, he’s in a different camp. He’s in the “I’ll fit as much of Cowhers chin in my mouth” camp.

Anyone wanna join Rip?

"Eff you mothereffer!"

-Bernard Pollard-

by Jordann on Dec 22, 2010 6:37 PM CST up reply actions   2 recs

Don't feed the troll

"The trouble with programmers is that you can never tell what a programmer is doing until it’s too late."

by nolander on Dec 22, 2010 7:25 PM CST up reply actions  

Technically...

Cowher may not even be responsible for LeBeau.

Cowher’s defensive coordinator, at first, was Dom Capers. Some times, coaches let coordinators pick their staffs and sometimes they have a hand in it or do it themselves. It’s good leadership either way, but LeBeau served under Capers.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 5:56 PM CST up reply actions  

But do we know that Capers picked him and not Cowher?

And did Cowher pick Capers as his first DC or was he there to start with?

I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now help me find my pants!

A word of advice for Texans fans. Remember John Milton's Paradise Lost: The mind is its own place. It can make a Hell of Heaven and a Heaven of Hell. Kinda sums up the last nine years, doesn't it?

by UprootedTexan on Dec 22, 2010 6:00 PM CST up reply actions  

I've looked into it

Can’t find who picked LeBeau (although that staff was impressive….Capers as DC with Marvin Lewis and Dick LeBeau as position coaches. Holy hell.). Cowher did hire Capers. Coaches in Pittsburgh are allowed to pick their coordinators.

Either way, that’s good leadership: Picking the right people to put around you and/or getting out of their way. Of course, that only speaks to his defensive side. If we’re all focused on defense then it sounds like we’re talking coordinators and not head coaches.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 6:04 PM CST up reply actions  

Look at it this way

It’s never a coincidence when great coaches come from great staffs, and they almost always produce future great ones as well. If Cowher was associated with that group of coaches, it was because he’s a good one himself. Can we agree on that?

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 8:43 PM CST up reply actions  

In that instance...

I don’t want to say that as a 100% maxim because Bill Belichick’s assistants pretty much blow.

For Cowher…it’s about even, but I’ll give him credit for identifying great assistants. I think he does a good job, more so defensively, of identifying talent that fits his philosophy so there’s no lapses across the board.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Dec 22, 2010 9:47 PM CST up reply actions  

I just had a wet dream

McNair hires Cowher to take over and then Cowher hires the recently fired Marvin Lewis as DC. BONER ALERT.

Choo Choo! Get on board the Marvin Lewis train for 2011 Defensive Coordinator.

by DaGoaT on Dec 23, 2010 8:28 AM CST up reply actions   1 recs

That's what I call manlove....

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

by Rip Jersey on Dec 23, 2010 11:35 AM CST up reply actions  

Replyfail.

Should’ve been up there after DC’s comment.

by Nashmeister on Dec 22, 2010 6:03 PM CST up reply actions  

My only concern there would be

How many times has the head coach of a team ever come back to that same team as a coordinator on either side of the ball? I just don’t see Capers doing it, though I wouldn’t mind seeing it at all.

I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now help me find my pants!

A word of advice for Texans fans. Remember John Milton's Paradise Lost: The mind is its own place. It can make a Hell of Heaven and a Heaven of Hell. Kinda sums up the last nine years, doesn't it?

by UprootedTexan on Dec 22, 2010 6:15 PM CST up reply actions  

NNNNNHHH....

…please UT… I’m beggin’ ya’… Don’t. Even. Kid. About. That.

"velocitas eradico"

by DilloTex on Dec 23, 2010 6:16 PM CST up reply actions  

You really wouldn't want Dom Capers to come back as a defensive coordinator?

I’m not saying bring him back as head coach, I’m not completely out of my mind, y’know. But look at the job he’s doing in Green Bay and tell me he wouldn’t make a damn good DC here.

Again, it won’t happen, I’m thinking due to ego/pride, but as a DC, we could/have done worse.

I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now help me find my pants!

A word of advice for Texans fans. Remember John Milton's Paradise Lost: The mind is its own place. It can make a Hell of Heaven and a Heaven of Hell. Kinda sums up the last nine years, doesn't it?

by UprootedTexan on Dec 23, 2010 7:03 PM CST up reply actions  

As DC absolutely... we're golden...

The root comment of this particular thread was supporting Dom Capers as Head Coach… THAT’ s the thought that keeps me up at nights…

"velocitas eradico"

by DilloTex on Dec 24, 2010 12:21 PM CST up reply actions  

I don't think anyone is seriously saying Capers should be HC again.

I don’t think anybody wants to go through that headache again.

I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now help me find my pants!

A word of advice for Texans fans. Remember John Milton's Paradise Lost: The mind is its own place. It can make a Hell of Heaven and a Heaven of Hell. Kinda sums up the last nine years, doesn't it?

by UprootedTexan on Dec 24, 2010 1:13 PM CST up reply actions  

Best HC EVER.

"Eff you mothereffer!"

-Bernard Pollard-

by Jordann on Dec 22, 2010 6:38 PM CST up reply actions  

LMAO!!

BOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Dec 22, 2010 8:47 PM CST up reply actions  

Great coaches hire good assistants so he prob

did succeed with them and he will need to hire good ones again if he came to Houston

That is part of being a HC

by Alious on Dec 22, 2010 8:55 PM CST reply actions  

Here's a piece from Texans Gab that looks at teams and their needs for a new HC

Link

I didn't do anything wrong!.... and, I won't do it again.

Send Vonta Leach to the Beach! http://www.nfl.com/probowl/ballot?

by Rip Jersey on Dec 23, 2010 7:30 AM CST reply actions  

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