Free Agent Defensive Backs Thread
by Jordann on Feb 11, 2010 11:50 AM CST
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Because Thursdays are slow days at work. I present to you the Free Agent Defensive Backs Thread!
A good number of people here in our beloved community are of the opinion that we should draft a CB or a S with our 20th pick.
Although I disagree, I can see where they are coming from. With Dunta being our top corner and the aging Eugene Wilson as our starting FS, I dont blame them one bit. Drafting Patrick Robinson or Earl Thomas can go a long way into solving our secondary deficiencies but there's plenty of 2nd and 3rd round talent in this draft to supplant that need.
And there's also the Recycle Bin a.k.a Free Agency.
Leigh Bodden, CB, Patriots. Age: 28
When the free agency period started last year, I wanted the Texans to take a look and eventually sign Bodden. He's a talented corner that would've had a pretty good year if he wasn't being used in the Lions "True Red Carpet" Zone Defense. Sixteen games, 55 tackles, 3 interceptions and a defensive touchdown later; Bodden proved himself to be one of the better corners in the league.
Carlos Rogers (RFA), CB, Redskins. Age: 29
I know that he's an RFA but if they get a new CBA done, he'll be a UFA. So im crossing my fingers on this one. I've been a big fan of Rogers since his days at Auburn and it's easy to forget that he won the Jim Thorpe award back in 04 because the past couple of seasons have been rough on him. Although his raw stats aren't attractive, Rogers still had a good season compared to some cornerbacks in the league. IMHO The Redskins are going to try to lock him up with a 4-year deal but he'll decide to test the waters first. A pretty hefty price, but if Rick Smith can pull off a sign and trade with the Redskins for Rogers; i'll forever be a fan of Smith.
Nathan Jones, CB, Dolphins. Age: 28
A former 7th round pick by the Dallas Cowgirls, Jones signed a 2 year deal with the Dolphins after his contract expired. Reunited with his former coach, Jones continued his progression and had a career high in both tackles(54) and interceptions(2) this past season. Whether or not a new CBA is done, Jones will be an unrestriced free agent so expect a lot of teams to be figthing for his services.
You're probably wondering why I didn't put any safeties up. Well, im under the impression that the Texans won't sign a big name Safety in the free agency because we've never done it before. Even the signing of Bernard Pollard was a surprise to me. And I also expect the Texans to re-sign the Bonecrusher.
As for FS, I can see Eugene Wilson taking over the starting position once again and having Barber back him up. They've both had a decent year and eventhough Wilson is getting older, he's still a capable starter.
So what say you BRBers, which defensive back would you like to see in a Texan's uniform this coming season. And if they are RFA's give us a reason why they would be worth that compensation.
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I don't know about Bodden
He had a good year for sure, but how many times have free agents left the Patriots to sign big time contracts elsewhere then do squat the rest of their careers? Fact is the Patriots are very good at getting the absolute best out of players, playing to their strengths and protecting their weaknesses.
I have a feeling that same CB who was incapable of playing zone coverage for the Lions is still inside of Bodden, and as has been mentioned before, the Texans play quite a bit of zone coverage.
It’s my opinion that the most talented free agent corner in this year’s class was on our team last year. Robinson was coming off a serious, potentially career threatening injury, missed all of preseason, and struggled this season.
If he leaves and goes to another team I think there’s a decent chance he improves in his second year back from injury with a full off season of work put in and we spend the rest of his career wishing we’d resigned him. His whole career he’s been one of the best players we’ve had defensively, to let one bitter contract dispute taint how he’s percieved as a player on the whole, I think is a travesty. There’s very few players who have played as hard for us as Robinson has over his career.
Bodden.
That’s the reason why he never shined for the Lions. It’s because they kept forcing him to play zone just like how we’re forcing Frenchy to play zone.
That’s why im not a big fan of Frank Bush but im not about to bitch about it because he did have a good season for a rookie DC. With Bodden, you gotta play to his strengths and that’s what the Patriots did. He’s always been better at man to man situations.
If Frank Bush isn’t willing to play to his personnel’s strengths, then you’re right about Bodden being a bad fit for us.
As for Dunta, I disagree. I don’t think he’s the most talented FA CB this off-season. I still think that Carlos Rogers or Leigh Bodden takes the cake. If this was pre-injury Dunta, then i’ll be nodding like a bobble head.
That last paragraph really got me thinking. I was very turned off with Dunta’s actions and it caused me to jump in the “FUCK DUNTA!” bandwagon. But you’re right about him though, there’s not a lot of players that played hard for us during the crappersly era. With that being said, I still don’t think he’s worth all that money he was asking for. If we can get him for cheap, then im willing to give him a chance.
"Played well as a nickel corner in 2009. Because no CBA has been reached, Nate Jones is one of the top unrestricted corners on the market."
Damn, I don’t think we’re gonna shell out a lot of money on a CB.
I really think it's bring Dunta back or not
As far as FA corners go. I can’t see us investing in a 28 year old nickel corner.
Ellis Hobbs
Though he’s coming off an injury, he’s a corner that has played against no. 1’s and 2’s when he was with the Patriots and then played slot with the eagles because of their great corners. He is a RFA but I’m not sure if the eagles will decide to keep him. He didn’t fit their scheme (hobbs is more of man-to-man while the eagles run that crazy 4-3 zone blitz). If they don’t give him a tender, we could grab him cheap. If we grab a corner, I don’t want to spend a lot of money on one.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 11, 2010 12:22 PM CST via mobile reply actions
Ellis Hobbs
You’re right about him playing against plenty of WR1’s and WR2’s but most of the time he had safety help. And when that safety help is Rodney Harrison or Ty Law, you really don’t have to worry about messing up.
Well, it depends on your view of safety help
But Ty Law played more corner than he played safety. Plus, Ty Law was not on the Patriots anymore when Hobbs joined the team.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 11, 2010 4:52 PM CST up reply actions
Hmmm.
I’m actually not sure about that one yet.
My feeling is that theres going to be an initial swell of big contracts signed for the Skins and Cowboys and their ilk. Then everyone else will have to go bargain shopping.
So it really depends which wave Bodden is on.
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter
by riversmccown on Feb 11, 2010 1:12 PM CST up reply actions
Skins probably
But don’t forget that the Cowboys finished as one of the top 8 teams, so they will have different rules this off-season when it comes to free agents. One of those rules says something about how they can only pay one UFA a salary of 5 mil or more. I tried to find the actual NFL.com story about the new rules, but I was able to find this that says it about the same:
http://www.nationofhiphop.net/sports-talk/92974-nfls-new-final-8-rule.html
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 11, 2010 2:56 PM CST up reply actions
No I've heard this rule floating around too.
I don’t know how they are going to apply it yet. I was just trying to come up with big spending examples and the Cowboys came to mind.
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter
by riversmccown on Feb 11, 2010 3:37 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah, I had it posted on another thread here.
Question 10: What is the Final Eight Plan?
Answer: During the Final League Year, the eight clubs that make the Divisional Playoffs in the previous season have additional restrictions that limit their ability to sign unrestricted free agents from other clubs. In general, the four clubs participating in the championship games are limited in the number of free agents that they may sign; the limit is determined by the number of their own free agents signing with other clubs. They cannot sign any UFAs unless one of theirs is signed by another team.
For the four clubs that lost in the Divisional Playoffs, in addition to having the ability to sign free agents based on the number of their own free agents signing with other clubs, they may also sign players based on specific financial parameters. Those four only will be permitted to sign one unrestricted free agent for $5.5 million (estimated) or more in year one of the contract, plus the number of their UFAs who sign with another team. They also can sign any unrestricted free agents for less than $3.7 (estimated) million in year one of the contract with limitations on the per year increases.
In the case of all final eight teams, the first year salary of UFAs they sign to replace those lost cannot exceed the first year salary of the player lost with limitations on the per year increases.
You try finding the actual story.
It’s not so easy. Besides, unless you read bottom up, there’s nothing else to read after the link.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 11, 2010 4:09 PM CST up reply actions
Still,
It’s not easy finding that story. You think I didn’t hesitate posting a link to nationofhiphop.net (not even a .com)?
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 11, 2010 4:45 PM CST up reply actions
here's the nfl.com source
http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d808736ba&template=with-video&confirm=true
but you’ll still have to read from the bottom up
Mount Cody in round 1
You actually get the information faster
if you go bottom up.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 11, 2010 5:01 PM CST up reply actions
that's all I'm going to say.
Stopping messing with the axe effect…
Confucius says "man who stands on toilet, high on pot".
experts predict
that there will be a lot more trades this year than before..
1. because of the final eight rule
2. because before, there would have been cap penalty and crap when taking over player wage, but without cap, it will be the teams who decide..
Die hard Texan fan from the heart of Denmark!
excellent
more excitement on the first day, that will offset only having one round on that day
Mount Cody in round 1
CBs are expensive.
I think for the price you could get a mediocre CB for, you could probably get one of the better free safeties in the game. I suppose Atogwe might get franchised again, but if he hits the free-agent market, it’s definitely something to look at.
I would feel infinitely better about our secondary if we had Atogwe/Pollard at safety. I suppose it’s a lot of money to devote to safety, but hey, uncapped year, amirite?
It will be interesting to see how the specter of an uncapped season affects spending
The local fishwrap (er propaganda shop) reports that our man Bob says it will not change his plans. I believe that Dan Snyder and Jerry Jones will have a hard time containing themselves with no spending limit. The Redskins in particular could be in for a total remake with the influx of high $$$ talent. Danny Boy’s been burned plenty in the past (see Fat Albert), but me thinks he will not be able to resist the temptation to spend like crazy.
It took the Astros 44 years to get to the Series, the Oilers-Texans are due to get to the big dance...Go Texans!!!!!
by oiler-texan diehard on Feb 11, 2010 4:14 PM CST up reply actions
It really doensn't matter
because whoever the Skins pick up will turn to crap shortly thereafter.
Confucius says "man who stands on toilet, high on pot".
Can Dunta really TURN to crap?
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter
by riversmccown on Feb 11, 2010 4:51 PM CST up reply actions
Didn't get to add
We get to play the Skins this season. Please AJ versus Dunta. Please AJ versus Dunta.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 11, 2010 4:55 PM CST up reply actions
That sounds like something he would say
Of course he thinks he is worth $11 million this season.
It took the Astros 44 years to get to the Series, the Oilers-Texans are due to get to the big dance...Go Texans!!!!!
by oiler-texan diehard on Feb 11, 2010 5:15 PM CST up reply actions
He shut down AJ in practice! Let's give him a huge long term contract!
Round one of the Texans’ CB tryouts: See if they can shut down AJ. If they do, they can stay.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 11, 2010 5:23 PM CST up reply actions
and then there's the fact
that if said player is on the defensive side of the ball, he’s got the Shanahan defensive jinx workin, also.
Mount Cody in round 1
That settles it...
someone call the Skins and let them know we have decided to trade Dunta for a seasoned vet, a pro bowl caliber, an up and coming , their best beer salesman.
Confucius says "man who stands on toilet, high on pot".
At what point does he stop banging his head against the wall?
I don’t know if it’s more pitiful or comical, but logic would dictate that at some point he would change his strategy. I kind of feel sorry for him.
It took the Astros 44 years to get to the Series, the Oilers-Texans are due to get to the big dance...Go Texans!!!!!
by oiler-texan diehard on Feb 11, 2010 5:03 PM CST up reply actions
(To clarify) The above comment is in reference to Daniel Snyder, not Cunta
for whom I have very little sympathy. Yes he was horrifically mutilated on a dark Sunday in the Black Hole, but virtually all of his actions since then have been not too cool. I want Smith to play hardball with him, and not give him what he thinks he is worth. Let some other team get burned.
It took the Astros 44 years to get to the Series, the Oilers-Texans are due to get to the big dance...Go Texans!!!!!
by oiler-texan diehard on Feb 12, 2010 12:09 AM CST up reply actions
what about
Darren Sharper to a 1-3 year contract? Would be an improvement over Wilson, and lets us concentrate on other stuff for a little while.
While Sharper can still play the FS
I don’t see the Texans giving him a deal due to his age. That’s just my opinion.
ya
I mean, a long-term deal is definitely out of the question. But a short one (if he’d take that)?
by killtacular on Feb 16, 2010 12:10 AM CST up reply actions
Supposedly the Saints are franchising him.
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter
by riversmccown on Feb 16, 2010 7:56 AM CST up reply actions
I have the solution for the CB position
We sign Darrell Green.
Dude was just clocked at running a 4.43 40 yard dash on his recent 50th birthday. He’s the perfect choice to replace Dunta Robinson.
Chargers are shopping Cromartie
what would it take, what would we give?
I’d probably give a 2nd. Don’t know if that would get him, but he’ll be 26 this year, and he’d start. Good deal for us.
Mount Cody in round 1
Just published a fan post about this.
I think that 2nd is too much.
How about a swap on draft positions for the second round and the fifth pick that we received as compensation for TJ
I'll take that deal
that would be a no brainer for us.
But I don’t think they will give up a former 1st rounder for that.
They will take a starting RB from another squad, or a high draft pick, I would think.
Mount Cody in round 1
I agree with the writer
The Texans do not need to draft high for a defensive back. The have Reeves, who was slowed at the start of 2009 with a broken leg. If he is fully recovered, all he has to do is work on turning his head and he can cover any #2 WR in the league. Glover Quin is coming off his rookie season and performed so well that Coach Kubiak said, “if not for Brian Cushing, Glover Quin would have been in the discussion for rookie of the year.” And, Dunta Robinson, who will either be signed, which I hope for, or be franchise tagged, not desireable. Robinson, hopefully has learned from his mistakes and will take steps to be with the team in OTAs, Preseason and working with the Defensive Coordinator, things he missed out on last season. Those three form a solid core that the Texans will be able to count on. I can’t see any rookie available after 19 being able to come in and supplant any of those players.
At Safety, Pollard…need I say more? And, yes Eugene Wilson has to come back from last year’s injury. But, he was sold and if he is healthy as he should be I just don’t see a rookie coming in and stealing his minutes.
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
That sounds like it all hinges on Dunta signing
But I think with the quality CBs in the second/third rounds, they should grab one.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 17, 2010 4:31 PM CST up reply actions
I'm not buying
Quin would have been in discussion for ROY. Is that just for the Texans or was he thinking league wide because thats a garbage statement if that’s what he was implying. GQ was OK and that is all. I think he might turn out to be pretty good/ solid #2 CB but I’m not buying into all the hype just yet. There were so many more impact rookies that would have won ROY/DROY over Quin. With all that being said, I do hope he becomes the CB we all dream of.
With the CB picture as bleak as it is for us I would take a chance on Cromartie or Bodden or anyone we think could come right in and make us a little better at the position. I think you do this and then get a CB in round 2 and let him learn the system in order to get ready/start for the 2011 season (Please God let there be one!).
Confucius says "man who stands on toilet, high on pot".
I think he said "in the conversation" on ROY
What I was getting at and it seems I differ a bit from some…I don’t think we need to expend a high draft pick on a CB or S. I like OL in the 1st round. In the 2nd and 3rd I would like to see DT and RB, in no particular order. AND, if the Texans thought they needed another OL in the 2nd or 3rd rounds, I would not object, because I think that part of the team is sorrowful and needs some young studs for now and the future. If some Act of God were to happen and Rolando McClain fell to the Texans in the 1st round, I would snatch him up so quick over just about any other player except Suh or McCoy. But, CB/S, I neither see as a Texans priority or that a player that can help them as being available.
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
I can see the Safety
but I think we need a CB in rounds 1-4, at least one.
Even if we get one in FA, our CB1 situation is dire. Our CB2 situation looks like it did a couple years ago, with Fred Freakin Bennett coming off a decent rookie year. How did that work out?
We have Frenchy in the nickel. If we don’t move him to CB1 are you just keeping status quo and tagging DRob? That’s short sighted, to me.
You always need youth and depth at CB. We have a CB2 with youth, but we could always use an upgrade at CB1 and depth. We need one in FA and early in the draft. Oh, and another late in the draft.
Mount Cody in round 1
The position is the most crowded position on the team
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
sorry
I thought we were talking about CB, not TE.
Some people will be released, yes. Some people, Quin, can be freed up to help out at Safety, yes.
Upgrades are possible, and needed. We have bodies at that position, I agree. We need upgrades at CB1 and CB2.
Mount Cody in round 1
Yes, you got me on that one...
It is possible someone will be released or Dunta is unsigned/lost in free agency. There is Bennett, yes, he could be the guy that is released. There is McCain, who was a mid-rounder last year and received valuable playing time last year and was not awful…agree, he is not a #1. I might agree that none of the current CBs are #1s. I might also venture a guess that none of the CBs in round 2 or later are #1 CBs. I might also say that the only #1 CB in the entire draft is Joe Haden and he is in the top 5 picks of the draft. So, my expectations are that the Texans will not find the guy we want for #1 in the draft. So, I will not lose sleep in maintaining the status quo at that position going into training camp. I might add that, except for the the team that drafts Joe Haden, all the other NFL teams are in the same boat as the Texans…probably not finding that #1 CB in the draft and settling for the status quo next year or just supplementing their quantity. I think the Texans are full of CBs. I don’t think the situation will improve in the draft.
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
tp, can I call you that?
How about this. We have a BRB guy going to the Combine next week. How about if we ask him to key in on the available CB pool and see if he can pick out some CBs that might be possible early round draft selections for the Texans. Rivers would be a good guy for that task because he has spent time watching the current Texans CBs on tape. So, if he is watching with the specific goal of trying to identify those draft-eligible players that would supplant certain current Texans players, then that would give us some great perspective on this.
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
status quo
To me, status quo at that position assumes too much.
We have history, Bennett, and Cromartie is another example, of first year CBs not improving or even equalling their performance in their second year.
So my position is, if CB1 – Dunta, CB2 – Quin is our plan, its very tenuous. Could be decent, could be terrible. If we get a FA CB and one early in the draft, we have a much more solidified defensive backfield.
But I see your point about reaching. If we don’t upgrade CB1 or CB2 at any time we’re picking in the draft, we don’t take that player. Its not worth it with our other positions of need.
But if there is talent available, that must be considered a position of need.
Mount Cody in round 1
Depth does not equal quality
We need to grab one CB in the draft (like the second or third round) to give us a possible starter at the position. Again, you are basing this off the chance that we sign Dunta. Behind Reeves and Quin, who do we have? Reeves can hold the #2 spot or slot pretty well. Quin can be a #2 or FS, but he’s stuck at CB because no one can take his spot. Bennett is the only other possible corner and he’s going to have to rebound after last year. Out of those, i don’t feel real comfortable about the CB situation.
Yes, we need O-linemen, but how many positions need to be replaced? Two. So, there, give the first and third round to the offense, give the second round to the defense to grab a CB. Draft a NT or RB in the fourth or fifth depending on which is a better value.
And if you think Quin will stay at CB, then we’ll need depth at FS (depth can be found in the later rounds).
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 18, 2010 11:44 PM CST up reply actions
I forgot to add
that even with Dunta that I would not feel better about the situation. Dunta will need to show that he can still be the player he was before the injury, which is possible, but I would not cling to hope in that situation. The only way I would feel comfortable at the CB position if we were able to sign a guy like Leigh Bodden.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Feb 18, 2010 11:47 PM CST up reply actions
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