The Great Amobi Debate
For the past couple of seasons, Amobi Okoye has generated a lot of debate amongst Texans fans. Some are quick to write him off as a first round bust, while others still argue that he is young and doesn't have a real compliment next to him to consistently rush the passer.
Every year it seems like someone in the media labels this the year that Amobi has his "breakout season." A statement that now generates nothing but scoffs and facepalms amongst most of the Texans fan base. I mean, you can only hear that so many times before you just don't take it seriously anymore.
I'm one of those people that never liked the pick and think he just may be a lost cause. I want to say that he's still young and a giant pile-moving guy like a Dan Williams or Terrence Cody next to him on the defensive line could really help him. But I'm not positive about saying I believe that would be the case. But there are times where it seems like the team is setting him up to fail by throwing guys like Shaun Cody out there next to him. Don't get me wrong--Cody isn't a bad player. But he isn't a starter on a stout defensive line. And he certainly isn't going to help a guy like Amobi be dominant.
Yes, he is younger now (he is still only 22 years old) than a lot of the guys in this year's NFL Draft. But has he shown consistent improvement each year as he gains experience? It sure looked like he was going to make me eat crow after being named defensive player of the month in September 2007, his rookie season. He tallied 4 sacks that month, which led the AFC. But since then, he has netted only 4 more in two and a half seasons.
One just has to wonder at this point if he is headed down the same road Travis Johnson did. Amobi still seems to have more supporters than Johnson ever did, but that really isn't saying much. I hate to give up on a guy that is so young and the team invested so highly in. The tenth pick in the first round (does it bother anyone else that Patrick Willis was drafted right after him?) should be held accountable. I'm not saying he should just be guaranteed a starting job simply because of where he was picked. I'm saying that if even someone like me who never liked the pick and really isn't a fan can give him another shot, I think others should too. But I do believe this may be his last chance. I'm personally hoping the team drafts a legitimate big to pair up with him on the front line.
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Fuck Dunta
Some people say "If you can't beat them, join them". I say "If you can't beat them, beat them", because they will be expecting you to join them, so you will have the element of surprise.
by Kiratomi on Apr 1, 2010 11:45 AM CDT reply actions 3 recs
fuck
beaten.
Be judgmental about the actions of the past, be hopeful about the actions of the future. -The Homers Creed
i really put effort into this
i had to not read a Kerns article and post first, it was rather difficult to accomplish haha
Some people say "If you can't beat them, join them". I say "If you can't beat them, beat them", because they will be expecting you to join them, so you will have the element of surprise.
i love your articles
its a serious compliment!
Some people say "If you can't beat them, join them". I say "If you can't beat them, beat them", because they will be expecting you to join them, so you will have the element of surprise.
I think he hasnt lived up to the requirement of the 10th pick in the draft yet, but I also believe its too soon to write him off. He’s not exactly bad, so with a little help next to him maybe he could become good. He def. needs to start showing something more though.
Be judgmental about the actions of the past, be hopeful about the actions of the future. -The Homers Creed
That's kind of where I'm at
I want to get a true big next to him and see how he does. If they do that and he still wets the bed…well, he can go to SD with TJ.
by Mike Kerns on Apr 1, 2010 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
ok now that ive read the article i can post a real comment
i think that in time he will develop, we just need someone on the inside next to him to help him up the middle, its tough when you have 5 guys focused on two players 80% of the time (Okoye and Williams) i mean Smith helped a lot, but he isn’t enough to really get our line over that edge, imo.
Some people say "If you can't beat them, join them". I say "If you can't beat them, beat them", because they will be expecting you to join them, so you will have the element of surprise.
You can't have pro-bowlers at every position though...
And as the 10th overall pick, Okoye is the guy who aught to be creating opportunities for the players around him instead of waiting around for more talented players to give him easy opportunities. Does he still have the potential to improve? Certainly. But there’s plenty of talent around him; Mario and Antonio Smith take some of the heat off of the defensive line, and DeMeco and Cush bail him out on his shoddy run-stopping.
Dan Williams might make his job easier (although I still think he’s a two-down player as long as Smith and Barwin are on the team). But if he really can’t succeed until he has four first round picks and a high-priced free agent around him in the front seven, then it was a wasted pick at #10.
oh no, i get that much
i just mean that we need a big NT to push the o-line, thats something we dont have and will need regardless of whether we had drafted Amobi or not, hes good, he just needs to not be our only DT, i mean its like we are running a 3-3 not a 4-3, we need one other player at the nose to push us through.
Some people say "If you can't beat them, join them". I say "If you can't beat them, beat them", because they will be expecting you to join them, so you will have the element of surprise.
He hasn't lived up to it
but he’s also not a bust. He’s a ridiculous 22 years old. There’s plenty of time for Amobi to shed that bust label. Last season, I distinctly remember cheering Amobi at least once or twice a game for a tackle or doing something. That’s better than he has been so far.
I think, as was said on Mocking the Draft, that Amobi’s been miscast as a run-stuffer. There’s a reason why everyone wants Dan Williams, Terrence Cody, Cam Thomas, Torrell Troup, Jay Ross, or Linval Joseph so Okoye can get back to shooting the gaps.
Looking at his size and what he’s shown, there’s no reason why he can’t be Kevin Williams, Jr if we get him a planetoid and let him go one on one with an OG.
"Lord, beer me strength."
I don't know
Although I think a planetoid might help, all too often I feel like Amobi age is used to justify his limitless “potential” and it’s just that. Potential. That’s why he got drafted so high- he really rose up the draft boards on the theory that if he’s this good now, can you imagine how good he’ll be in a few years? Sometimes I wonder if this is as good as he gets. And that’s ok. I’d be fine with that if we’d drafted him in the 3rd round or below.
I don’t think he’s bad, parts of his game are good. But so far, he hasn’t been worth the 10th pick of the draft. There are flashes, but personally, I sometimes even saw flashes in Travistar. Anyone playing in the NFL (except Jeff Zgonina or players named K/Chris Brown) will have the occasional flash. I’m just sort of whatever on him, nothing personal, I just think we overpaid for what we got.
Are you saying..
that Jeff Zgonina never did anything flash? I think being the second oldest player in the league and starting at DT is pretty awesome to begin with. I’m still hoping that they can bring him back this season, even as a back up.
A Texas Wannabe, born and raised in New Zealand. Currently located 7539 miles South west of Houston.
by distant_texans_fan on Apr 1, 2010 9:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Good point
His longevity is noteworthy in and of itself.
Fumble recovery to win in week 2.
Rudimentary creatures of flesh and blood, you touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance, incapable of understanding.
I agree with Okoye being not used properly
Play a guy to his strengths.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Apr 1, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Doesn't a debate have people on both sides?
I think even his ardent supporters would say he’s been a bust so far, and his biggest detractors would admit he’s still really young and there is a chance he busts out.
Like I said way back in the DL piece, I’d like to see a better player on the line by him and I’d also like to see him rotated a little more because I personally feel like he wears down quickly. It’s really hard for me to take his production and excuse it under the subheading of “he’s young!” though. Even if we do fix up everyone around him, I don’t think he’ll ever be the kind of DT we drafted him to be. I think his upside is “good” and we’re more likely to see him be “solid” or “average”. Not Travis Johnson bad, but maybe someone more along the lines of Rocky Bernard.
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter
Patrick Willis
Was not drafted. He was ordained. Patrick Willis directed providence to place him in San Francisco, and it was so. Patrick Willis is the master of his own destiny.
by JimboTexan on Apr 1, 2010 12:11 PM CDT reply actions 7 recs
Patrick Willis drafted the 49ers
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter
by riversmccown on Apr 1, 2010 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions 7 recs
About the Patrick Willis thing
I never saw these posts by 49ers fans basically dubbing him Jesus Christ. Not that I don’t believe it, I just didn’t see them. Can anyone post a link to this now infamous thread? Thanks.
Here ya go
http://www.ninersnation.com/2009/10/19/1092388/many-reasons-for-optimism-heading
Rudimentary creatures of flesh and blood, you touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance, incapable of understanding.
The best part which I can’t find anywhere, is where I was told our Play Action wouldn’t work because Willis is too fast, and how little chance Slaton had in the screen game or short pass game because Willis would stomp him. How did that work out for them?
Rudimentary creatures of flesh and blood, you touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance, incapable of understanding.
Well, at first
I thought they weren’t really hyping him up any more than we do DeMeco. But it just gets worse and worse the farther down the thread I scroll…
more reference
http://www.battleredblog.com/2009/10/21/1095690/five-questions-with-niners-nation
Rudimentary creatures of flesh and blood, you touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance, incapable of understanding.
epic threads
and hilarious…especially in hindsight
by HoustonTransplant on Apr 1, 2010 4:09 PM CDT up reply actions
beledat.
it seems like time is being controlled by patrick willis, making the off-season a lot longer that it seems just to show us how powerful and awesome patrick willis really is.
BOW DOWN TO YOUR MAKER!
by typhoon.infamous on Apr 1, 2010 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
rec'd
A Texas Wannabe, born and raised in New Zealand. Currently located 7539 miles South west of Houston.
by distant_texans_fan on Apr 1, 2010 9:57 PM CDT up reply actions
The part of me that grew up a Niners fan cringes a bit while reading that. Some of it is logical, but it really delves into homerism as you scroll down. I thought the Texans would win, but was surprised that Alex Smith and Vernon Davis made it a close one.
The funny part? Drew said he’d be surprised if OD caught more than 2 passes for 15 yards.
The actual game? 7 catches, 123 yards, and 1 TD.
"Lord, beer me strength."
We were just talking about this the other day.
I never liked the pick. I was going for Landry or Levi Brown. But I never hated the pick either.
He hasn’t played up to his potential. Im willing to give him a couple more years with talent being around him. D-Will for example.
I don't know your friend.
Although I’m sure you and mystery man are bff.
Bacon tastes good... Pork chops taste good.
Amobi isn't the problem...
…but he’s not the solution, either. He may never pan out to be more than an above-average starting DT, but I’m fine with that. In hindsight, I really wish we had used that #10 pick for Darrelle Revis, but we have Okoye and he’s a good player. To get the most production out of him that we can, we need a run-stuffing DT. If we hadn’t drafted Okoye, we’d still need a run-stuffing DT anyway. Our defense is one or two players from being truly special, which brings me back to the strong opinion that we not draft Matthews from Fresno State.
I expected more from a #10 pick
Sure adding someone like Dan Williams would possibly let Okoye flourish. Maybe he would perform the same regardless? Who knows.
Another side of me says we’ve put enough investment into the DL and need to invest more into the OL. I would hate to see Schaub take so many damn hits again, and Dan-O starting.
I’m with Loftin on Revis. But oh well.
by HoustonTransplant on Apr 1, 2010 1:01 PM CDT reply actions
Good Article, Kerns
Personally, I’m tired of waiting on Amobi. He was drafted tenth overall, and young’n or not, we haven’t sniffed anything approaching an impact since the first month of his rookie season.
At what point does age stop being part of the discussion? Next year? Year after that? Year after that? Before we know it, Amobi will be seven years into his career, yet there’ll still be people saying, “He’s only 26! Give him time to develop!”
Looking forward to a day when being a Texans fan doesn't mean that April is the highlight of my season...
Actually
I’m with you, Tim. I just didn’t want to write about how much I can’t stand the guy and hear everyone say “Same ol’ Kerns…he’s just so negative and mean!!!”
I think he’s garbage.
And THERE'S the real Kerns....
I was wondering what had happened!
Bacon tastes good... Pork chops taste good.
So
Who is going to replace him? He may never be All-World, but he’s certainly not the problem on our d-line.
Until we get to the point where he is clearly the weak link in the chain or we decide not to re-sign him, we’re going to have Amobi playing the UT.
And really, giving up on a 22-year old, even if he is a third-year pro, is kinda silly. This isn’t basketball, where a young guy can excel. His body is still filling out.
I'll eliminate you like I eliminate gluten from my diet.
by tehGrindCrusher on Apr 1, 2010 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Re: So
I’m not saying that there’s a better candidate on the roster to play UT than Amobi; I don’t think there is. Of course, that’s an indictment in its own right of the Houston DTs.
22 or not, the guy’s been making tenth-pick-overall money for the last three years. We’re entering the fourth year. It’s not too much to ask that he consistently resemble what the Texans thought they were getting when they drafted him.
Looking forward to a day when being a Texans fan doesn't mean that April is the highlight of my season...
by Tim on Apr 1, 2010 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
It's not...
but when he’s not played to the strength of his abilities, whose fault is that?
I’m not cutting him slack. I think he played OK last season, but expect more…but that depends on Smithiak and Bush utilizing him to his strengths.
"Lord, beer me strength."
Re: It's Not
Agreed that he hasn’t been given what’s likely the best opportunity for him to thrive—a planetoid DT next to him who could free him up to penetrate into the backfield.
Then again, it’s becoming increasingly clear that the Texans may not value huge DTs, preferring for smaller, quicker players at the position. If that’s the case, it does not look like Amobi will ever be what we hoped he would be.
Looking forward to a day when being a Texans fan doesn't mean that April is the highlight of my season...
by Tim on Apr 1, 2010 2:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Just because one hasn't fallen in our laps??
I challange anyone to find something where Smithiak said, “We’re not interested in (NT-X) because he’s too big and strong.”
Other than Raji (who we never had a shot to get) last year, how many NT’s have there been that we missed on? Ngata (who was in the Mario and Demeco draft)?
I mean, we drafted your boy Okam, didn’t we? That draft pick made it increasingly clear to me that they DID, in fact, have some interest in a big body.
Bacon tastes good... Pork chops taste good.
Clarification
You’re dead on about Okam, and I can’t think of a big NT we passed on (at least not off the top of my head) that realistically would’ve been good value for where we were drafting.
What I was referring to was Bill Kollar’s purported preference for smaller, quicker, agile defensive linemen, as opposed to the planetoid DTs we’ve been screaming for since ’08.
Looking forward to a day when being a Texans fan doesn't mean that April is the highlight of my season...
by Tim on Apr 5, 2010 9:12 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think that's the point of this sidethread
So much as the point is: the fact that when you make the 10th overall pick in the draft, you hope that player doesn’t need to be paired with other players to be a good player in his own right.
And it is a pretty big indictment of Okoye that he was picked so high and needs other people next to him to justify his existence.
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter
Maybe he doesn't need the NT
but it doesn’t change the fact that Amobi’s not being used to his strengths.
For all we know, Amobi’s doing what is asked of him…attempting to be the run-stopper next to Shaun Cody and DelJuan Robinson. It’s like Kansas City asking Bernard Pollard to be a pass-coverage safety as opposed to using him in the box as a SS.
It’s also not uncommon for a high draft pick to need other players next to him to make him look good. RBs need OL, QBs need Weapons….LBs need linemen who can keep blockers off of them…even DEs need someone on the other side so teams can avoid the double team….
"Lord, beer me strength."
I don't disagree, BUT
Superlative talents find a way to stand out in poor situations anyway. I don’t think Amobi has anything more than solid player upside at this point. Which is not what you’re hoping for out of #10, so I think that’s the line of reasoning going on here.
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter
I agree
At least we didn’t take Jamal Anderson that draft. I hope Amobi pulls it together.
It's not terrible money though
Okoye’s rookie contract has a max of 6 year, 17.6 mil. That’s a little under 3 mil a year. I think he’s good enough to play out the rest of that contract.
by theaxeeffect4311 on Apr 1, 2010 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions
*shrug*
I honestly don’t feel very strongly about Amobi anymore. I agree with those that want to see him next to a bigger DT and rotated more often. Either way I think he should and will get one more year to show he is not a wasted pick.
Rudimentary creatures of flesh and blood, you touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance, incapable of understanding.
if all else fails
we can get a 6th round pick for him?
Some people say "If you can't beat them, join them". I say "If you can't beat them, beat them", because they will be expecting you to join them, so you will have the element of surprise.
So a big beefy NT is drafted...
Shaun Cody, DelJuan Robinson become rotational DTs………Antonio Smith sometimes moves in sometimes…..we have NT and Amobi start. That’s a lot better than what it is now.
"Lord, beer me strength."
by TexansDC on Apr 1, 2010 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Travis Johnson?
That’s a horrible comparison. Even if Amobi isn’t putting up the sack numbers we might like, he’s still better than TJ by any possible comparison.
I'll eliminate you like I eliminate gluten from my diet.
I don't know
Trent Green’s head might disagree.
Easily a top 10
DGDB&D post…I tried to link to it, but apparently that’s no longer possible. More’s the pity.
My thoughts on Okoye
I think Okoye’s biggest problem is that he had Richard Smith as a defensive co-ordinator his first two years. I don’t think it’s a surprise that his best month was his first month in the league. He was still using his natural instincts right out of college, and then Richard Smith taught him how to suck. So at the ages of 19 & 20, he had to forget what was great about his game and start that “read and react” bullshit. I still want to see him with at least one more year under Bush, and maybe he’ll even have a fierce new NT next to him this year.

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