Owen Daniels: Start Him Week One?
by Tim on Aug 25, 2010 4:45 PM CDT
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PrintOwen Daniels received medical clearance by Dr. James Andrews today. Kubes says OD is "fired up." Andre Johnson says OD's fist is pumping. We're awaiting word from Matt Schaub as to whether Daniels' foot is a tappin'.
Before Owen Daniels went down in Buffalo last year, he was having as good a season as any TE in the league. In games where OD played, your Houston Texans were 5-3. They proceeded to lose their next four (4) after OD went down before rallying to finish 4-4 sans Owen Daniels. At first glance, it might be tempting to pull out the ol' jump-to-conclusions mat and declare that losing OD submarined the Texans' 2009 season. Speaking of jumping...
Joel Dreessen did an increasingly admirable job filling in for Daniels as the season progressed, and truth be told, Schaub managed to post 300+ passing yards in five of the eight (8) OD-less contests. Thus, it strikes me as a bit erroneous to attribute the 4-4 finish to the '09 season strictly--or even mostly--to Owen Daniels' absence. The passing game remained strong without OD, which is not so much a slight to OD as it is praise for the Texans' system.
With that reality in mind, is there any way you consider bringing Daniels back slowly if you're Smithiak? If OD doesn't get any preseason game snaps, do you feel good about inserting him immediately into the starting lineup when the games start to count in Week One? Or do you ease him into a role, splitting time with Dreessen and James Casey, with an eye toward increasing his workload steadily to a point where the transition to starter is much more gradual? Voice your strategery in the Comments below.
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Start him
mix in Dreesen, and if OD isn’t getting it done stick with Dreesen.
Have you ever tried just turning off the TV, sitting down with your children, and hitting them?
I imagine they’ll have a snap count for OD unless he goes out and explodes from the first snap. Of course, Owen’s worked hard to rehab so I imagine he’ll work hard to get into game-shape in practice.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see them mix and match. With OD, JD, and Thor, the Texans have weapons at TE. It’s up to Kubes and Dennison to utilize them. Given Thor’s improvement….I definitely hope to see a goal line formation with JD and Owen at TEs, Thor at FB with Foster behind him, and then Andre and someone else at WR. That’s just dynamic. The coaches could get creative with the personnel……just hopefully not the plays.
"Lord, beer me strength."
Agree w/ TDC
The answer re: Starting is Yes. He’ll be the starter because he’s OD.
But I could very easily see where he is not the TE with the most snaps in Week 1…even as the “starter”.
If the Treasury Secretary doesn't have to pay taxes, then why do I?
I say start him
He should hopefully be at 100% by what, week four
by AllenOU on Aug 25, 2010 5:47 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
OT: Where the hell are my goddamn TShirts?
I’m sitting here waiting to give you money!
Have you ever tried just turning off the TV, sitting down with your children, and hitting them?
by nolander on Aug 25, 2010 6:26 PM CDT reply actions 3 recs
Yes! This takes priority over starting OD or not....
My thoughts exactly. The FO of BRB has really let the team down on procuring some Tee-shirts. How, I say, how can you expect me to go to the tailgate party in the Red Lot this Saturday without flashing my new BRB tee-shirt? How? I want to know!
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
Notice the BRB FO is ignoring us
either that or I will have my BetaT for this Saturday’s tailgating….what do you think?
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
Personally haven't commented because
I have no idea what the deal is with that. I know Tim is trying to solicit help from one of our users who is a graphic designer, and that has been going slowly. Thats about all I’ve got for you.
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter | SB Nation Houston | Battle Red Blog
by riversmccown on Aug 26, 2010 7:54 AM CDT up reply actions
What Rivers Said
We’re working on it. Designs have been discussed; it’s really a question of what store we use to print ’em.
Looking forward to a day when being a Texans fan doesn't mean that April is the highlight of my season...
I will email a name to you
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
Other
What? This isn’t a poll? Okay, no, he hasn’t practiced. I say start Dreesen and bring OD, Casey, Graham in off the bench. All the other TEs have performed exemplary during the preseason and I don’t feel any hesitation in putting any of them in there.
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
start don't start doesn't matter to me
It’s like the #2 wr argument with JJ and KW…It Really doesn’t matter. Rotate him in and out till conditioning/timing are 100%.
"Well, at least our players kept their helmets on, so that showed some intelligence"-Bob McNair
by papabear on Aug 25, 2010 7:56 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
As TDC said, Start, but not necessarily the most snaps...
Earl Campbell is the perfect combination of assmass and weightspeed. - Papabear
Start him and play him like you would normally
Look Joel Dreesen is nice and all but he’s not in Owen Daniels league. Owen Daniels is consistenly one of our hungriest players and he’s rehabbed this injury twice before already. He’s ready to go, the doctors say he’s ready to go..so you play OD like the top-5 tight end he is.
Also, he’s Schaub’s most trusted safety valve when defenses double and triple cover Andre. They’ve had that chemistry since 2007 and they’ll have it again. Can’t wait for OD to be back.
by leacheatsbabies on Aug 25, 2010 10:44 PM CDT reply actions
In addition, OD is the best toy for a QB
he runs the full tree of WR routes as a TE..and they move him all over the field. He’s a nightmare on for defenses on 3rd down.
by leacheatsbabies on Aug 25, 2010 10:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Contract year
Everyone knows that most if not all players excel in their contract years. Therefore, it won’t matter as someone else stated if he starts. He will make a difference even if he is just a decoy because of how good he is. As long as he produces I could care less if he starts or comes off the bench.
Feeling the five stages of grief since 2002.
by NoSafetiesNeeded on Aug 25, 2010 11:06 PM CDT reply actions
Start the hell out of him!
OD is being paid to play and he is one of our most valuable weapons. He’s cleared and has rehabbed extensively. Try to take it easy with him and you run the chance of that thought process getting in his head. Tenativeness leads to more injuries. So start him normally and let him play 100% from the start.
We don't know what OD is right now.
Is OD post surgery and no camp the same as 09 OD who went through an entire camp? The Texans want their TEs to block—especially because the running game is being emphasized this year. Is he going to be able to throw one of those blocks that Casey did to help spring a runner? When is the right time to come back after surgery to make sure his knee takes.
I don’t think anyone knows the answers to these questions yet.
Right
You have to bring him in slowly and in appropriate/key situations. Plus, he has to practice with the team. I suppose that is starting right now. From a strategy point of view, it would be good for the team to keep quiet on his progress. If he is really ready to play in the first regular season game, don’t make it public. Keep the Colts in the dark.
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
Addendum to your last sentence:
and feed them shit.
If the Treasury Secretary doesn't have to pay taxes, then why do I?
Hopefully they do that on gameday....
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
Ease him in
You said it in the main article. The Texans still posted multiple impressive passing performances without OD. However, I feel like he was Schaub’s favorite target down at the goal line and so I would really like to see him inserted situationally, particularly in scoring situations.
Fantasy wise
I drafted OD as the 6th or 7th tight end taken, but listening to Kube’’s comments on the radio is sounds like he will be worked in with the others the first game of the year. So personally it sounds like he won’t be getting all the catches at TE week one. Accordingly I drafted a backup TE with my last pick, just to play week one, and there are lingering injury concerns. I do think I will be starting OD every week after the first, and expect big things from him.
Funny when the team strategy gets compared to the fantasy strategy
it’s a sick world we live in….
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
I have a question
Why doesnt Thor play for FB? It seems like it would be a huge threat to have a guy like that to pass protect and to come out of the backfield on checkdowns or flat routes. At the same time it does not seem like we would lose much in a lead blocking situation either with his size and power. I just imagine a package similar to what texanDC said before with OD @ TE and AJ and KW outside and Thor and Foster in the backfield. Sounds confusing to the defense and dynamic for the offense. ANy porblems or agreement?
by theSpaceCityKid on Aug 26, 2010 1:49 PM CDT reply actions
The problem is that Kubes has said
he wants Casey to focus on one position (TE). Of course, Gary also said he loves that Thor has taken up long-snapping because he makes himself valuable to the team. Yes, completely contradicting himself…but the point is they wanted to settle Casey down so who knows what the deal is. In terms of Thor at FB in certain packages, I would love it. It’s a very creative package that throws out another great weapon. That’s the great thing about the skill positions, they are really deep.
"Lord, beer me strength."
I think he will hit a home run if Kubes moves him around
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
With SOOOO many tight ends
and the way JD has been playing isnt that kind of a waste? I am somewhat confident in Leach’s play at FB but I would be much more confident with the diversity that Thor would prvide to our offensive sets. I f we could hit him on that swing pass that we always try to do with Leach it would be a great play I think. It seems like with everyone else Kubes wants them to be able to play multiple spots but not with a guy that has the ability AND that plays at a spot where we have ridiculous depth? Hmmmmm….
by theSpaceCityKid on Aug 27, 2010 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Dickerson too
I want to see goal line offense of Andre and Dorin on the outside. Dickerson can jump like 8 feet…add Thor and OD, and Foster. What are you goind to defend? Thor can motion and lead block for Foster, both TE’S go out, fake the dive and do a fade either Andre or Dorin…let me at that playbook.
meaningful football games in '08...MAKE THAT 09, okay 10, definitely 10..i am an excellent driver
What I like about this is they all have good hands
good Red Zone personnel
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
OD matters more than he gets credit for
“The passing game remained strong without OD, which is not so much a slight to OD as it is praise for the Texans’ system.”
I’ve seen this sentiment written all over the internet and it drives me nuts. This couldn’t be more wrong. Sure, the passing yards held up, but that’s it. Here’s how it breaks down (note: I’m counting the Buffalo game as post-OD as he went down before the end of the second series and only posted a single reception):
Numbers are per game unless specified otherwise.
TD/Int for Schaub with OD: 2.3/0.7 to go with a 102.8 QB rating.
TD/Int for Schaub without OD: 1.4/1.1 and a 94.2 QB rating.
YPA dropped from 8.4 to 8.1 and ypg held up (actually increased slightly) only because Schaub was attempting more passes per game.
You could ask about the competition that the stats were posted against. Well, the defenses we played in the first 7 games were actually better, allowing 217.3 ypg, 6.9 ypa, 1.2 TDs while posting 1.1 Ints per game (all passing stats). The last 9 games? 225.6 ypg, 7.1 ypa, 1.4 TDs and 1.0 Ints. So we played better against the tougher defenses during the time we had OD in.
Schaub’s game numbers versus the opposing defense’s averages:
1st 7 – +79 yards, +1.5 ypa, +1.1 TDs, -0.3 Ints and +22.5 QB rating
last 9 – +74 yards, +1.0 ypa, +0 TDs, +0.1 Ints and +8.8 QB rating
Also, while the records the team posted looks similar (4-3 vs 5-4), the 1st seven teams posted a win % of 49.5% on the season (excluding the matches against the Texans) while the latter group posted a 48.1% (same caveat).
While the passing offense is still good without OD (Schaub == the man), we still desperately need him on the field or someone else to step up. The difference in the red zone performance is striking after OD went down.
by gcopping on Aug 26, 2010 3:51 PM CDT reply actions 4 recs
Welcome....
always glad to see a newcomer in this corner of the Internet and definitely hope you stick around cause you brought the meat. You put up a very compelling argument that I, as a anti-OD guy (anti in the sense that he can be replaced), can’t readily counter off the top of my head…although I will give it thought.
"Lord, beer me strength."
I enjoy this post.
There’s not enough difference in the stats to make me feel like the Texans lost much though. Especially considering how weighed down that winning percentage is just by the Rams.
- Rivers McCown, From Mom's Basement | Twitter | SB Nation Houston | Battle Red Blog
by riversmccown on Aug 26, 2010 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions
There are lots of ways to read game stats like this
I don’t does that make it interesting, meaningful, confusing? You be the judge.
Why might a team pass more? Because they have to? Because they are behind and have to catch up quickly before time runs out? What stats never do is take into consideration situations. Every play is a situation. Lump them all together and you lose the meaning of all those situations. Bottom line, in so many ways, you can make stats tell nearly any story you want.
I’m not dismissing gcopping’s stat analysis. I like it. I’m just sayin’
I suppose if all of the stars, moons and planets align it could be possible, but what are the chances of that?
most of them are a wash...
but the difference of a TD per game? That one kind of matters. (Also reflected in the QB rating.) There’s been a lot of consternation about the red zone offense and while I have no game film evidence to back it up, I think Schaub lost one of his favorite red zone targets in OD.
Could that production be replicated by another player? Sure. Absolutely. But last year it wasn’t.
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