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Around SBN: Win or Lose, Boston Celtics' New Big 3 Era A Success

The news from Pro Football Weekly isn't much of a shock, but it looks like the Texans will attempt to retain their two key free agents on the offensive side of the ball. Whether they'll receive more lucrative offers from other teams is another story altogether.

A little throwaway line at the end also foreshadows the uphill battle Trindon Holliday could face to make the team if there is a preseason and training camp. I'm going to place my bet on practice squad at best.

11 months ago Tumblr_l4i6iruxha1qbs5d3o1_400_tiny TexansDC 82 comments 0 recs  | 

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I still think Trindon will make it.

JJ was no great shakes as a KR last year, and everyone else who tried was worse.

The Two-Day Hangover @ SBN Houston | Twitter
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"MDC: Droppin' knowledge like a librarian with Parkinson's." --Jonathan Loesche
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"Not to completely equate marriage to fandom, but both rely on suspended insanity a bit." --beefy

by MDC on Jul 7, 2011 3:11 PM CDT reply actions  

Ouch

That’s cold blooded, but I actually did “lol”.

by Ryan81 on Jul 7, 2011 3:28 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Hey, now...

not just anyone can field a kick three-yards deep in the endzone and step out of bounds at his own one-yard line. THAT is a rare skill. (Thankfully.)

The Two-Day Hangover @ SBN Houston | Twitter
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"MDC: Droppin' knowledge like a librarian with Parkinson's." --Jonathan Loesche
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"Not to completely equate marriage to fandom, but both rely on suspended insanity a bit." --beefy

by MDC on Jul 7, 2011 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

what game was that, again?

I think that might have been when I officially lost hope in anything coming from the season, but I’m not sure.

by Calvinball on Jul 7, 2011 6:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Redskins, Wasn't It?

I could be wrong, though. They all tend to run together in a 6-10 campaign.

Looking forward to a day when being a Texans fan doesn't mean that April is the highlight of my season...

by Tim on Jul 7, 2011 10:11 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

What the picture doesn't show is him going down immediately after getting the ball.

Canal Street Chronicles-A place of great Saints news and information. Oh and the stuff I write!
"I rejected those answers. Instead, I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose...Rapture!"

by Jon Banks on Jul 7, 2011 3:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

hope so dude can fly

He looked so overwhelmed in preseason though. Hopefully he will have some patience this year

by jtr bmf 281 on Jul 9, 2011 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

Just saw that Vodka is retiring

I hope we don’t feed Mario anything the day before they let him out of the cage against the Titans, so he’s like a hungry rabid dog. They’ll be on 3rd string in the 2nd quarter if they have Hasselbeck and Lockler.

by WhiskeyR on Jul 7, 2011 3:50 PM CDT reply actions  

Whiskey saying vodka is retiring

There is something just wrong about that, Oh, you mean THAT vodka

My name is Barry - I am from Texas

by Barryfromtexas on Jul 7, 2011 9:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

id like to hear everyone elses thoughts on jj

i spent all season long HATING jacoby, for the fact that everytime he was thrown the ball, especially on 3rd downs where he was in the game most, he would have drive stalling drops…it sux hes a FA and we cant try and get somthing out of him via trade..we really dont have nething to plug in for him (regardless of the thoughts of guys who thing dd will be a big impact this year) but still at the end of the day, to me, he has more neg impact then positive…its his job to catch the ball, so to get excited when he does..is moot to me…am i the only one that went thro all of last season like this?

by Mike Ram on Jul 7, 2011 4:59 PM CDT reply actions  

I sorta like him as a punt-returner, still.

If we hadn’t committed penalties on 99.99% of our punt returns last year, he’d have had a respectable season back there.

I also agree with Kubiak’s stance that you don’t spend a few years developing a guy, then let him come into his own somewhere else. He was raw when we drafted him, he has shown flashes of brilliance (unlike Okoye), and he should still be fairly cheap.

by Nashmeister on Jul 7, 2011 6:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Same here

I personally like the kid (obvious Kubism) and still think he has dynamite potential. I also think he’s not as dumb as his aw shucks, country boy persona makes him out to be. No doubt he knows what the talk is surrounding him, and if he’s smart he’s putting a lot of focus into improving his catches and his attention to detail. it’s the only thing keeping him from being great in my opinion.

Even though he drops the ball at the most inopportune times he still makes a great deal of impact plays. I have no problem if we re-sign him.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 7, 2011 8:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Plus, it can't be restated enough

He knows the offense, and with a shortened off season who else is going to step right in and be up to Jacoby’s speed right away? Let’s not forget that this is a make or break year for Kubiak and he can’t afford to take risks on a free agent when he already knows what he has in Jones.

#kubiakbelievesinhim

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 7, 2011 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

2 great points on the punt returnin

And about kubes bein in a make or break year n not wantin 2 wait for some1 2 come up 2 speed.. but im talkin about good of team for this year n beyond..trindon can return n a free agent pik up will learn his plays at the X position enough..plus at the end of the day u can teach bigger hands m i really think thats the only reason he has the drops..so do we buy a new whip or put in more money in the one we got that keeps needing to go bak in the shop..

by Mike Ram on Jul 7, 2011 8:26 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

CANT teach Bigger hands N i really think thats the

….id blame the cell but i f up all of my comments…

by Mike Ram on Jul 7, 2011 9:20 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

I don't think hand size is Jacoby's problem

Maybe for someone with Anderson’s frame but Jacoby is a fairly big dude for a receiver, and it’s pretty uncommon for someone that size to have small hands.

Personally I think his problem is concentration. A lot of his mistakes come from either anticipating his steps after the catch or the contact he is going to receive if/when he makes the catch. That split second that his eyes are looking up field or he’s thinking about getting hit can be the difference in a catch or a drop. You always hear coaches talk about looking the ball into your hands, and all of the great receivers are masters at it.

That’s definitely something that’s coach-able, but I have to assume it’s more difficult for punt returners because if they aren’t anticipating their initial moves to avoid contact then they tend to get blown up.

Bottom line: I think Jones has all the talent if he just keeps improving his concentration. And don’t underestimate his knowledge of Kubiak’s offense. A free agent may be able to come in and learn the basic routes in his first season, but Jacoby (and I assume Walter as well) are expected to know the routes of each position in case Andre goes down. That would be a lot to ask a first year FA. That’s why I say Kubiak would rather roll with Jacoby and Walter.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 8, 2011 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

forgot about the -looking for the hit before the catch is made-

great point to bring up again..i remember looking back on old game films with him and THAT being a big part of his drops..and ur right that it is uncommon but if u google “jacoby jones small hands” it does have a pic and u can see hes got the hands of 5’9" guy…but i did like the guy a ton as a rook, i thought he would be further along at this point and he made me loathe netime he was on the field last year, but at the end of the day, uve convinced me to give me a clean shot this year to win me bak..

by Mike Ram on Jul 8, 2011 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions  

Heh, I didn't know about the hand size thing

Thanks for pointing that out. In the pics I saw they didn’t look that small, but Jones himself says he can’t even palm a girl’s basketball so I’ll take it for what it’s worth. So yeah, that could have something to do with the drops but I still question his concentration. There were times when I noticed alligator arms when he went over the middle, plus he was looking up field on a few drops. Hopefully he works on that because I really would like to see the guy take it to the next level.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 8, 2011 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions  

It was the one flaw in his pre-draft measurables.

Most wrote it off, and it’s something that can certainly be improved upon with technique. But it’s certainly a disadvantage… Still, if he’s capable of making a catch like that two-point conversion in the Baltimore(?) game, then he’s capable of catching anything; it’s just a matter of consistency.

by Nashmeister on Jul 8, 2011 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's what I'm sayin

Some of his catches are pretty sick. Remember the one in the preseason game his rookie year? Right corner of the endzone, and I want to say it was a one hander but I could be wrong.

He’s got plenty of ability. Even as much as Breaston in my opinion, although I think he’s more polished at this point in his career. Jacoby was definitely raw when Kubiak found him, that’s not even debatable, but I gotta give props where they’re do. He’s come a long way since then and I think he’ll play a long time in the league, even if it’s not as a Texan.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 8, 2011 8:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

yep

I would keep him just on his return ability. True he has had some drops at important times in games like that drop aganist the cowbitches in the endzone at the end of the game in the preseson that would of won the game. But Ive seen him make some good grabs as well.

by jtr bmf 281 on Jul 9, 2011 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

We'll probably carry 25 offensive players on the 53.

3 QB’s
5 WR’s
4 RB’s
1 FB
4 TE’s
8 oline

Holliday will definitely have problems making the roster. He would have to take up either the 3rd QB’s or 4th RB’s spot. No way he takes the 5th WR’s spot. I can see us carrying 2 QB’s again, with TJ Yates on the practice squad.

"...you may all got hell, and I will go to Texas!"
-Davey Crockett

by Drill Sarge on Jul 7, 2011 6:37 PM CDT reply actions  

we dont keep 3 QB's active

2 for game day and 1 PS guy
Last year we had 3 after Lienert but I think Kubes was just seeing who sucked more, hin or Olousey

I Want to Believe

by Fox Mulder on Jul 7, 2011 7:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

You think only four TE's

Haha. That’s cute…

I see myself as an entertainer and an Icon. Oh and C finnegan can go fuck himself

by AllenOU on Jul 7, 2011 7:54 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

I was thinking that too. At LEAST 4 TE's and of course

no less than one dead hor… DilloTex? Help me out here?

by WhiskeyR on Jul 7, 2011 8:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

A dead whore?

My name is Barry - I am from Texas

by Barryfromtexas on Jul 7, 2011 9:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think the top 3 TE's are a given,

but Anthony Hill get’s the nod on the 53 over Garrett Graham and Graham is resigned to the practice squad for the regular season. I think Graham was drafted to hedge the possible loss of OD in FA or if he didn’t come back to full strength. OD, Dreesen, Casey, and Graham all have the same skill set— pass catchers, but not very good blockers on the line of scrimmage. Anthony Hill will be given the opportunity to earn a spot because he is a different TE and can play different roles than the other guys play on special teams (meaning he would be a better front line blocker on both punt teams and kick return). Hill Is almost the same size as Mario Williams (he’s listed at 6’6" 277), where the other 3 are all about 6’3" 240. That will at least get him on the 53, IF he stays healthy and doesn’t get the swine flu. . . again.

"...you may all got hell, and I will go to Texas!"
-Davey Crockett

by Drill Sarge on Jul 7, 2011 8:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

No doubt Hill is the best blocking prospect of all the TEs

But I’m not so sure where this talk about the rest of them not being very good blockers comes from. I think Dreesen’s strength is more blocking than catching, and OD has steadily improved every season. Plus, Casey has been rumored to replace Vonta at FB if he’s not resigned. They wouldn’t even consider it if he weren’t a very good blocker, right?

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 8, 2011 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

If you go with 2 QB's on the 53 man roster

than you have to have a QB on the practice squad. Your defense needs someone to practice against that simulates the opponents and that is usually the 3rd QB. The top 2 spend all their time with the offense going over game planning. The extra QB does extra duty by simulating the other teams QB. I think Yates will happily go to the practice squad while he comes up to speed in the NFL, and Kubiak (as well as sume of he draft pundints this year) seem to like him.

"...you may all got hell, and I will go to Texas!"
-Davey Crockett

by Drill Sarge on Jul 7, 2011 9:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

No offense to the long snapper

But can someone else do that job to free up a spot?

My name is Barry - I am from Texas

by Barryfromtexas on Jul 7, 2011 9:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

Whose gonna bring the kickers donuts than??

"...you may all got hell, and I will go to Texas!"
-Davey Crockett

by Drill Sarge on Jul 7, 2011 9:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Dreessen can

but he focused on TE last year (and he was pretty solid for us in that role).

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Jul 7, 2011 9:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Isn't Dreessen the long snapper?

Good tight end, good snapper, seems to free up a roster spot?

by WhiskeyR on Jul 7, 2011 9:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

I thought this last year too

When I saw him running around pre-game at the stadium and said to my wife; “who the he’ll is that guy”? Then looked at the roster and saw “long snapper” by his name. Really?!!! We eat a full roster spot for this guy? Is the position really that unique?

by MeMongo on Jul 8, 2011 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's not what I meant by Yates to the practice squad

He’d have to be cut from the main roster and clear waivers to make it there. I don’t think that’s a given nor do I think Houston should risk it when Yates is, arguably, more talented than the only other back-up under contract.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Jul 7, 2011 9:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

Pretty sure he meant

“re-sine” and “re-zine”.

You don't play to just play it.

by RocketsAstros on Jul 8, 2011 3:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

i think that he will make the roster

i personally would rather have trindon on the roster than david anderson…

by Samarth Sulhan on Jul 8, 2011 5:12 PM CDT reply actions  

And I really don't get why some folks are down on D.A.

He’s been clutch his entire career, and the little dude can take some serious punishment. Also, how many times has he come up big on special teams? I can remember several fumble recoveries. Is Holliday going to do that for us?

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 8, 2011 8:51 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Several fumble recoveries?

I think you’re thinking of someone else. http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/8000

The Two-Day Hangover @ SBN Houston | Twitter
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"MDC: Droppin' knowledge like a librarian with Parkinson's." --Jonathan Loesche
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"Not to completely equate marriage to fandom, but both rely on suspended insanity a bit." --beefy

by MDC on Jul 8, 2011 11:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Help me out here

Where is the stat category for fumble recoveries? I see fumbles and fumbles lost but not recoveries.

Whatever it is I know I’ve seen him recover a fumble(s) on special teams, and the point is does anyone expect Holliday to do any better?

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 9, 2011 2:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

Here you go.

http://www.nfl.com/player/davidanderson/2495796/careerstats

No career recoveries. One career fumble, which came on a - wait for it - punt return.

The Two-Day Hangover @ SBN Houston | Twitter
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"MDC: Droppin' knowledge like a librarian with Parkinson's." --Jonathan Loesche
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"Not to completely equate marriage to fandom, but both rely on suspended insanity a bit." --beefy

by MDC on Jul 12, 2011 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Rec'd for truth

DA has earned his spot on this team.

by WhiskeyR on Jul 9, 2011 9:07 AM CDT up reply actions  

yeah it wasnt intended as a knock against d.a

he can make good plays but as far as i’m concerned, he’s an average receiver and i would definetly rather have dorin dickerson out their rather than d.a…

and every team has that one really fast player, but i don’t think the nfl has ever seen a player as fast as trindon holliday…is it a stretch to say that he’s the fastest player the nfl has ever seen? because he might be…and i do think hes the fastest in the nfl right now…and what proof do you have that he can’t run a route or catch a ball? he didnt have his chance last year because of the thumb injury, but will this year…

by Samarth Sulhan on Jul 9, 2011 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

I still don't get why everyone keeps saying these things.

David Anderson has been a sure handed go to guy on third downs. Why would you want anyone different filling that role? A second year 7th round pick is your solution to a problem that doesn’t exist?

Dickerson’s upside is huge, but please, lets remain grounded in reality.

by WhiskeyR on Jul 10, 2011 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

that's chump change for a clutch guy like him

Think of him as our Danny Woodhead, if you will. A tough, all purpose 1st down machine who’s willing to take a beating to get it.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 10, 2011 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

dickerson is sure--handed

and you’re kidding yourself if on 3rd downs, d.a is schaubs first option…and theres alot of other guys on the roster who can make those catches : owen daniels, kevin walter, joel dreeson, arian foster, and some guy named andre johnson

by Samarth Sulhan on Jul 10, 2011 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think anyone's claiming he's a first option

But almost every single time the ball has gone his way on a 3rd down it results in a 1st or better.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 10, 2011 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

DA's the 4th guy on the depth chart...

It’s not like he’s a starter or anything.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Jul 10, 2011 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

But he's usually in on 3rd downs

He doesn’t do anything really flashy, but he’s always making a key first down when he catches it

Murphy’s 20th Military Law:
If it’s stupid, but it works, it ain’t stupid

by The Night Owl on Jul 11, 2011 1:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

You're probably thinking more of 2009 (22 catches for 1st downs on 38 catches)

because 2010 wasn’t a banner year (5 1st downs on 11 catches) for him nor does it demonstrate his value.

For comparison’s sake on Jacoby…
2009: 27 catches, 19 1st downs and 6 touchdowns
2010: 51 catches, 31 1st downs and 3 touchdowns.

Andre:
2009: 101 catches, 69 1st downs and 9 touchdowns
2010: 86 catches, 59 1st downs and 8 touchdowns

K-Walter
2009: 53 catches, 33 1st downs and 5 touchdowns
2010: 51 catches, 33 1st downs and 2 touchdowns

Dreessen:
2010: 36 catches, 24 1st downs and 4 touchdowns <<— This guy doesn’t get enough credit, so I’m throwing him in here as well.

You know…even though Jacoby could’ve played better in the 1st half of the season…he still did make a leap and matched Walter’s production. Something to be said for that…

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Jul 11, 2011 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions  

However it has been mentioned that Jacoby was given more playing time to try making that leap as a true #2 WR

We know what we have in DA, but we’re unclear if Jacoby is a true #2 or just a good #3 with questionable hands. As far as a #4 WR is concerned, I doubt we’ll do better than DA. Only Green Bay has a legitimate & dependable #4 WR better than DA

Murphy’s 20th Military Law:
If it’s stupid, but it works, it ain’t stupid

by The Night Owl on Jul 11, 2011 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

like dre being hurt

and “FOSTA, RUNNING BACK FAH BEERRHH” running like a mad man..had somthing to do with jacoby bein on the field more

by Mike Ram on Jul 11, 2011 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

In Anderson's best season (2009)

he was targeted on third down 23 times. The result:

11 first downs
8 incompletions
4 completions that did not get a first down

I don’t think we should get overly protective of a guy whose best year as a pro resulted in .7 third-down conversions per game, especially when 52% of the time targeting him on third down did not get a first down.

The Two-Day Hangover @ SBN Houston | Twitter
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"MDC: Droppin' knowledge like a librarian with Parkinson's." --Jonathan Loesche
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by MDC on Jul 12, 2011 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Just go back and read all of Kubiak's quotes from last season

Holliday was terrible as a receiver. According to Kubs he looked lost and needed to pull his head out of his ass or he wasn’t going to be on the field.

It takes a lot for Kuiak to openly criticize and individual player. Usually he just gives you the status quo, non descriptive answers when he’s not happy. When he goes on the record about a player sucking, you can bank on it being a legitimate concern.

Not saying the kid can’t turn into a better receiver, but there’s no way in hell I would want him on the field over Anderson any time soon. Not until Kubiak starts singing his praises from the roof of the stadium.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 10, 2011 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

Amen brutha

Preach on!

My name is Barry - I am from Texas

by Barryfromtexas on Jul 10, 2011 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

DA makes the carch on big 3rd downs

I def harder on jacoby but he is our 3rd wr not 4th..da is small but hes tuff as nails has no prob gettin in there makin the catch n takin the hit..no gator arms no lettin his eyes wander b4 the catch is made..the things that make me crazy bout jj..just not makin the catch..but da def deserves to be on the squad..

by Mike Ram on Jul 9, 2011 1:35 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Definitely true.

Everyone is so quick to armchair coach their way to improving our receiving core. I just don’t get it. David Anderson is freaking MONEY at receiver depth. He’s proven, sure hand and just like you say the guy comes up huge for us on third downs. I see no reason for a change when it comes to DA.

by WhiskeyR on Jul 10, 2011 12:06 AM CDT up reply actions  

the non-love for DA around here reminds me of Dreessen a couple years ago

You get exactly what you want out of each guy. They both play to the maximum of their expected/wanted ability with nearly zero faults. Yet two years ago some were wondering if Dreessen would even make the squad, what with Casey now on the team.

Well Dreessen is a better TE than Casey. And David Anderson is a better WR than Dorin Dickerson. I’m glad the real coaches don’t agree with the armchair coaches.

by WhiskeyR on Jul 10, 2011 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions  

ok you say he is good for 3rd downs plays.

Now answer this, when did you see him play last year?

by southpaw70 on Jul 10, 2011 8:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

He did seem to have a drop off in playing time last season

But I think that is mostly contributed to allowing Jones far more reps, to see if he’s ready to be a star. Most of the time it was some version of AJ, JJ, and Walter.

I don’t think the lack of reps proves anything except that those three are better overall receivers than AD, but that still doesn’t mean he hasn’t been clutch when he’s been on the field.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 10, 2011 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

YES

Exactly like the Dreesen thing.

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 10, 2011 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I wouldn't call him money

He had the lowest catch rate of the 4 WRs per Football Outsiders last year.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Jul 10, 2011 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not that DA's catch rate is low....

61% is hovering around league average, but the guy’s nothing special. I do expect Dorin to challenge him for snaps – Dorin taking over the 4th spot is realistic to me.

"Lord, beer me strength."

by TexansDC on Jul 10, 2011 7:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

The only way I see Dorin in the #4 spot

is if Jacoby Jones signs with another team. I don’t think we’ll sign some big name free agent WR to replace him either. A more likely scenario is the Texans grabbing a undrafted rookie WR like Terrence Toliver

Murphy’s 20th Military Law:
If it’s stupid, but it works, it ain’t stupid

by The Night Owl on Jul 11, 2011 1:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

Watch the highlights of our last two drives against the Ravens on Mon night

For a good sample of why I believe Jones has the talent to be as good as any of the FA receivers on the market, watch both the 99 and 95 yard drives. JJ was a big part of that come back. He was clutch on big downs and even had the 2 point conversion if I remember right.

I assume it’s still legal to post Youtube links?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ghV1HmRVfw

I'm a man!! I'm forty!!

by Hydroshock on Jul 10, 2011 2:41 PM CDT reply actions  

yep

He catched the ball that was thrown to Andre in the corner of the endzone.
I loved that would be comeback. I remember how fucking exhusted that Ravens D was on the sideline after that last drive before O.T. I think one of them had a I.V. in his arm

by jtr bmf 281 on Jul 10, 2011 4:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

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